How To Spend Money To Make Money (Even When You Don’t Have Any Money To Spend)

Jill Lightfoot:
I would be getting referrals from people that, yes, maybe we were Facebook friends, but did I really, really know them? Have I ever worked with them? No. You know, I think it was just that subliminal advertising that we were doing that wasn't annoying. You know, it wasn't like, "Jill's constantly there asking for business," blah, blah, blah, blah. You know, it was Jill living life.

Tim Chermak:
This is the Platform Marketing Show where we interview the most creative and ambitious real estate agents in the country, dissect their local marketing strategy, and get the behind-the-scenes scoop on how they're generating listing leads and warm referrals. We'll dive into the specifics of what marketing campaigns are working for them, how much they're spending on those campaigns, and figure out how they have perfected what we call the Platform Marketing strategy. This is your host, Tim Chermack, I'm the founder and CEO of Platform. I love marketing, and I talk too much. So let's dive in.

Tim Chermak:
Hey, everyone, and welcome back to another episode of the Platform Marketing Show. I'm here today with Jill Lightfoot. Jill is a kick-ass realtor in Columbus, Ohio. She's a Cleveland sports fanatic. As we record this interview right now, you guys can't see it because we're on Zoom. You're probably listening to the podcast, but she's got a massive like Cleveland Browns flag behind her. I believe she's also an Ohio State fan being in, you know, right in the Columbus area, obviously, where Ohio State is, and obviously, she's a successful realtor as well.

Tim Chermak:
Now Jill has a pretty cool story because Jill has gone from about $60K in GCI, which is probably like an average realtor, you know, right around $60,000 of GCI, to doing nearly $300,000 this year. So you could say that her business hasn't actually just quadrupled: her business has quintupled. I think that's the next one after quadrupled. That's pretty phenomenal.

Tim Chermak:
So Jill, welcome to the show. I'm super excited to have this conversation today with you.

Jill Lightfoot:
Thank you, Tim. I'm happy to be on here. Go Browns, go Bucks, Indians, Cavs, and we won't forget the Blue Jackets.

Tim Chermak:
So Indians, there, is it the Guardian or no, not Guardians-

Jill Lightfoot:
Yeah.

Tim Chermak:
What is it?

Jill Lightfoot:
No, that's right.

Tim Chermak:
It is. Okay. The Guardians coming up. Cool, cool. So yeah, I mean you're, you know, you're pretty privileged to have Ohio sports to follow because I'm from Minnesota. So we have to cheer for the Vikings, and most people don't even realize we do have a college football team. It's called the Gophers. They just usually win like three games every year and-

Jill Lightfoot:
Yeah.

Tim Chermak:
So you're much more lucky than you than you realize, but anyways, apparently we're supposed to be talking about marketing and business on this show-

Jill Lightfoot:
Right, right.

Tim Chermak:
So maybe we can have a conversation about sports afterwards, but-

Jill Lightfoot:
Exactly, exactly.

Tim Chermak:
Jill has a super cool story. Jill has, like I said, I think it's quintupled her business. I think that's the correct term, and it didn't start out that way, though. So the interesting narrative here that often emerges in a lot of these podcast episodes with Platform is an agent starts, they get kind of so-so results early on, or maybe even they're frustrated the first six months, you know, like they're barely breaking even or they're actually losing a bit of money relative to how much they're investing in marketing when they follow this Platform strategy, but somewhere around the six-month mark, the nine-month mark, you know, the year mark, all of it kind of kicks in and all of a sudden, that high-hanging fruit starts getting harvested and your business blows up.

Tim Chermak:
So Jill, you started kind of implementing the Platform strategy back in 2018?

Jill Lightfoot:
Correct. Yep.

Tim Chermak:
So 2017 was your last full year before you really launched all in on Platform. Talk to me about the difference between your business in 2017, kind of where your mindset was. That was, you know, back when you were doing about $60K in GCI. What were you doing for marketing back then, if anything, versus what did you start doing in 2018 when you joined the Plat Fam?

Jill Lightfoot:
So I was floundering, I guess, like everyone else. You know, I lacked the confidence. I had no direction. I knew that I needed to do something, and I knew that something was probably on social media, but I didn't know exactly what. Never really wanted to do videos at all. That was not my thing, and you know, then I would try some things on my own a little bit here, a little bit there, but when you have no one holding you accountable other than yourself, you know, you're on that rollercoaster of, "Oh, look at me, I'm doing great," and then all of a sudden, you've let it all fall off. So I knew that I needed to do something, and I knew that "something" was social media. I just didn't know what.

Jill Lightfoot:
So then I started seeing some Platform ads and I read your book and did some research, watched the documentary, and it all just made sense to me that that's what I needed to be doing, but I wasn't making a whole lot of money to be able to throw a ton of money into marketing.

Tim Chermak:
Yeah, you were in this-

Jill Lightfoot:
And-

Tim Chermak:
You were in this like really common catch-22-

Jill Lightfoot:
Yeah, yeah.

Tim Chermak:
If you want to call it that where-

Jill Lightfoot:
Exactly.

Tim Chermak:
Like you know that you need to invest more in marketing, but ironically, it's often the people who don't really have money to invest into more marketing who need to the most, you know-

Jill Lightfoot:
Right.

Tim Chermak:
Because if their business was doing well, they probably wouldn't feel the need to invest more into marketing.

Jill Lightfoot:
Exactly.

Tim Chermak:
And so at some point, I feel like, and I could probably do an entire podcast series just on this, this insight here or this idea, but at some point in every successful business, whether it's a realtor or you're a plumber, or you're starting a new software company or whatever, I mean really any type of entrepreneurial venture. At some point in every successful business, the founder had to take a risk early on and invest money they didn't really have so that they could get a greater return in the future.

Tim Chermak:
It's one of the biggest obstacles or challenges I see agents wrestling with because they're used to having this kind of like Dave Ramsey-influenced mentality of like, "Well, once I get more closings, then I'll take the money from those closings and invest it into marketing." It's like, "Right, but if that were true, you would've done that before." So you're basically assuming your business is going to spontaneously grow and then you'll have more money for marketing, but what if it doesn't spontaneously ever grow, giving you more money for marketing? Like at some point, you basically have to take a risk and "spend money you don't have," you know? So maybe that's putting some money on credit cards. Maybe that's getting a business loan. Maybe that's borrowing money from friends or family or your husband or your wife, or maybe even your kids. I mean, whatever. You have to invest money, you have to invest resources you don't have if you want to, you know, there's that old cliche expression, right? "To get results you've never had before, you have to do things you've never done before."

Tim Chermak:
So as you're telling that story, that just immediately leaps out to me because I see that common thread in like every Platform story. "I was scared. I kind of knew I needed to do something, and when I discovered this, Platform Marketing strategy, I watched the documentary," or, "I listened to the podcast," or, "I read your book," or, "It made sense to me, but I realized I didn't have the money because my business wasn't cash flowing enough to really invest in it."

Tim Chermak:
So I'll let you continue your story there, Jill, but that just immediately pops out to me because it seems like everyone hits that gap, that gap where you have to make a decision at that point.

Jill Lightfoot:
Yeah, and I think that's where the frustration is. I know real estate. I know how to negotiate deals. I know how to write a purchase contract, show homes, but I didn't really know about running a business. Like nobody ever taught us that, and I knew that I needed direction there. I had no idea what I was doing. Never once did it cross my mind that I needed to spend money to make money, because like of what you just said. I felt like I needed more money before I could start spending money, and that's kind of where Platform has directed me along the way. You and my account manager, Emily, and even agents in the group have directed me along, because that is not something we are taught.

Tim Chermak:
Sure-

Jill Lightfoot:
You know-

Tim Chermak:
Sure.

Jill Lightfoot:
Not at all. I didn't know what I was doing.

Tim Chermak:
So when you-

Jill Lightfoot:
As far as growing my business.

Tim Chermak:
When you first started, I mean, your business, if you're doing about $60,000 a year, you know, obviously if you put that in monthly terms, you're averaging $5,000 a month of GCI, but obviously anyone who knows anything about real estate, especially in a Midwestern state, knows that you're probably not making an equal five grand a month over 12 months. It's probably heavily concentrated in the spring and summers in Ohio, where it wouldn't surprise me at all if you had several months in the fall or winter where you had no closings come in-

Jill Lightfoot:
Yep.

Tim Chermak:
Because most of it's coming in the spring and summer. So there absolutely is times of year where your cash flow doesn't even slow down as an agent. It might have gone to zero, you know? So when you first signed up, my question is like, where did you find the money or create the money? Was it a situation where you had to convince your husband that it's like, "Hey, we need to pull money from savings because I need to do this to take my real estate career to the next level," or did you put it on credit cards? How did you navigate that decision? Because again, there's a explicit decision. There's this like crossroads that you come to where it's like, "Okay, either I can keep doing what I'm doing or I can take a risk and we'll have to fund this risk somehow, but we're going to have to spend money that I don't have in my real estate checking account. Like we have to basically put an infusion of capital in here," right?

Jill Lightfoot:
Yeah, yeah.

Tim Chermak:
How did you navigate that?

Jill Lightfoot:
I mean, I think that's basically what we did, if I am remembering back. I think we just put it on my business credit card and you know, what do they say is the definition of insanity? Doing the same thing over and over again?

Tim Chermak:
Sure, sure. Yep, yep.

Jill Lightfoot:
I knew that, and my husband did too. We both bought into it. We both knew, but it was a risk, and we were afraid. So yeah, I believe that's what we did, is we started off putting it on my credit card and just kept my ad budget low at first until things started growing.

Tim Chermak:
And so this is in 2018 that you first signed up for Platform.

Jill Lightfoot:
Yeah.

Tim Chermak:
What did your business look like, the changes in your business in 2018? I mean, like I would imagine you started filming more videos. Obviously a lot more content is going out on social media, and obviously we are recording this podcast. It's almost 2022 while we're recording this.

Jill Lightfoot:
Yep.

Tim Chermak:
And sometimes it's easy to forget looking back, that social media five, six years ago was still sort of considered like an up-and-coming thing. Now all of us just, like it's so integrated into our lives that we just think, "Well, yeah. Of course I'm advertising on social media. Of course I have a business presence on," whatever, "Instagram, YouTube, Facebook," but back then, it was kind of like, "Well, Facebook seems to be the up-and-coming thing. I should probably do some advertising there," you know.

Tim Chermak:
So there was still an element of risk back then of thinking, "Well, I'm pretty sure that's where I should be putting my money, but I guess we'll see how this pans out," right?

Jill Lightfoot:
Yep.

Tim Chermak:
So how did your business change from an outsider's perspective from 2017 to 2018? Like the first year you started Platform, was there more content going out? I mean, what were some of the ads that maybe you started started doing in 2018? Like the first year that you were implementing platform?

Jill Lightfoot:
Yeah. So the first year we, yeah, definitely a bunch of videos, which was way out of my comfort zone, but I knew I needed that push, and now I don't even think about it almost. It's become natural-ish, I guess. We were just doing a lot of homes list ads. So yeah, we were trying to capture leads.

Tim Chermak:
Yep.

Jill Lightfoot:
That was probably more of what we were, the most ads that we were doing was just trying to capture leads and, which that was good. I mean, that was kind of explosive almost. Almost too much to handle, following up on my own with all of the leads. Then, I don't know if I'm jumping ahead, Tim, but we, then I guess the next year we got more into the retargeting ads and just, as you would say, ads that don't look like ads.

Tim Chermak:
Yeah. Yep, yep.

Jill Lightfoot:
Those to me were more meaningful.

Tim Chermak:
Yeah because at that time, you had built up now, after you had done it the first year, right?

Jill Lightfoot:
Yes, right.

Tim Chermak:
You had built up a database and a retargeting list that you can start running massive retargeting campaigns to because obviously when you first get started, we can't do a bunch of retargeting right away because there's no one to re-target, right?

Jill Lightfoot:
Right, exactly.

Tim Chermak:
We first have to build up the database and everything. So it sounds like your first 12 months is mostly focused on generating as many leads as possible to just really build the retargeting list and start building your database from scratch, essentially. Not that you didn't have a database before as a realtor, but when most agents say, "I have a database," that means they have like 50 email addresses, right?

Jill Lightfoot:
Yeah.

Tim Chermak:
And we built that from whatever you had before to now thousands and, you know, probably a couple thousand leads in your database, which now means we can start doing a lot more retargeting.

Tim Chermak:
So let me ask you a very specific question.

Jill Lightfoot:
Yep.

Tim Chermak:
Did you make any money using the Platform strategy the first year? Like was it profitable for you? Did you break even versus what you spent on it versus the commissions that came in? Do you remember what it was like that first year in terms of-

Jill Lightfoot:
Yeah-

Tim Chermak:
Being profitable or not?

Jill Lightfoot:
I mean, I think I went up a little bit. I think I made $80K that year.

Tim Chermak:
Okay. So it-

Jill Lightfoot:
So-

Tim Chermak:
More or less probably just paid for itself, then, because-

Jill Lightfoot:
Yeah.

Tim Chermak:
Most agents are investing, at the bare minimum, right around like $20,000 a year, if they're really going to seriously implement Platform. So it sounds like your business grew barely enough to justify the expense. It basically just broke even. You may have even lost a little bit of money.

Jill Lightfoot:
Yeah. Yep, yep-

Tim Chermak:
So you-

Jill Lightfoot:
I still believed in it. I still knew that's what I was supposed to be doing, and I just kept plowing ahead. I mean-

Tim Chermak:
And-

Jill Lightfoot:
Yes, there were definitely the negative thoughts of, "Oh, is this what I should be doing? Is this good for my family? Is this"-

Tim Chermak:
"Is it worth it investing all this effort just to break even," right?

Jill Lightfoot:
Right, right.

Tim Chermak:
And-

Jill Lightfoot:
Yeah.

Tim Chermak:
I want to point that out and I want to emphasize that point because you know, I don't just want to skip over the fact like we're embarrassed or, you know, that, "Oh man, she only broke even her first year." It's like, "No, let's really talk about that," because that's a point where I think a lot of agents would quit. They would do a marketing program or, you know, try new marketing strategy for a year, and it costs, let's say $25,000 to implement. They only bring in about $20,000. So they either, you know, broke even or even lost a little bit of money. Most people, at that point, would quit. They'd be like, "Oh, well my business didn't blow up the first year," and they are thinking, maybe even logically, so I'll give most people credit. They think that they're like, "Hey, well I didn't give this three months or six months. I gave this 12 months to work. I really tried this for a full year and it only broke even. So I'm going to try something else."

Tim Chermak:
You had a longer term mentality, because this is something that we preach around Platform, is that if you think about it, if you even come close to breaking even the first year, don't think of it as, "Oh, I broke even on my ad budget." Think of it as, "I built a database of thousands and thousands of people for free," because as long as you even came close to breaking even, think about now the database of thousands and thousands of people that you have their contact information now, and they're following you on social media. You didn't have that before. So that's a huge asset. Like that shows up really in the balance sheet of your business. That's an asset, and as long as it even sort of broke even, it didn't really cost you anything to acquire that.

Tim Chermak:
So now you've rolled a big snowball and you kind of got paid for doing it, even if all you did was break even in the first year. So you hit that point, and you were really clear, like, "This really hasn't paid off. I haven't made any money. It's basically just broken even," and yet you continued into the second year. So what happened in, so this is now 2019, the second kind of full year of Platform. What did you see happen in 2019?

Jill Lightfoot:
So I definitely had more growth that year, and like I was saying about the retargeting ads, we started running, you know, just ads about normal life. Jill's normal life. Jill's boring life, you know, doing things with my daughter when we were riding bikes or doing sidewalk chalk. Just ads like that that I think that just warm people up to you. I guess, I don't know really how to put it into words-

Tim Chermak:
Yeah, it's basically like these, what do we call them, or what does Emily call them? The personal moment-

Jill Lightfoot:
Yep.

Tim Chermak:
Ads.

Jill Lightfoot:
Yes.

Tim Chermak:
Where it's like you, I don't know, go out on a date with your husband, or you go to a Cleveland Browns game. Let's really personalize this, right? You go to a Cleveland Browns game and you take a picture of, let's say you and your husband, who is a recovering Green Bay Packers fan, and he's-

Jill Lightfoot:
That's a true story.

Tim Chermak:
He's at the Browns game right with you, and you take a selfie photo there, and we basically write some copy around how you love going to games. It's one of your passions in life, that you really like following the Browns. It's a special three or four months every year where, you know, it's football season, it's NFL football season, and you feel blessed that you get to go to games and blah, blah, blah. We'll just write a quick story about how much you love this, right?

Jill Lightfoot:
Yeah. Just a couple sentences.

Tim Chermak:
Exactly. It's the kind of thing that people would normally post on their personal Facebook profile or their personal Instagram, not like a business page, right, and yet we run it as an actual retargeting ad. So this will start popping up in people's news feeds on Insta and on Facebook, and often, I think people don't even realize they're being advertised to because it pops up. I think they actually just think, "Oh, that's my friend, Jill. It looks like she's at a Browns game," right? So that stuff regularly starts popping up, and yet it's technically a sponsored retargeting ad because we know the only purpose of this ad. There's no call to action. It doesn't end with, "By the way, so if you're thinking about selling your house, here's my number. Let's talk," you know-

Jill Lightfoot:
Exactly. Yeah.

Tim Chermak:
There's no call to action whatsoever. It's just a personal moment from your life we wrote a quick little caption about, quick little paragraph about, and then those are what we run as retargeting ads because over time, if you do this once, it's not going to make any difference in your business, right?

Jill Lightfoot:
No. Yeah, that's what I was going to say. Yep.

Tim Chermak:
But over-

Jill Lightfoot:
We just kept pecking away.

Tim Chermak:
Yeah. Over time. If there's constantly new stories popping up, you do over time. That's the key. Stay top of mind with people, way more than you were before, and now, this is the important part, because you had the courage to stick with Platform into the second year after only breaking even the first year, now you're not just staying top of mind with like 50 people. You're staying top of mind with like 2,500 people that are in your database and in your retargeting list. So obviously, there's a lot more real estate deals and transactions and buyers and sellers to be had if you're staying top of mind with 2,500 people than if you're top of mind with the 50 previous clients you had in your database. So we start doing that. You're creating a lot more content. What starts to happen in 2019?

Jill Lightfoot:
That's just when I started noticing growth. I mean, it wasn't like, I couldn't say specifically it was exactly 10 leads or 10 people that came through my database. I couldn't say it was specifically that. It was all just, just all happened, and-

Tim Chermak:
You basically just noticed in a general sense, "I'm getting more phone calls this year."

Jill Lightfoot:
Yes, yes. You know, it was, I would be getting referrals from people that may, yes. Maybe we were Facebook friends, but did I really, really know them? Have I ever worked with them?

Tim Chermak:
Right, right.

Jill Lightfoot:
No. You know, I think it was just that subliminal advertising that we were doing that wasn't annoying. You know, it wasn't like, "Jill's constantly there asking for business," blah, blah, blah, blah. You know, it was Jill living life. You know, all positive, fun things. We get a little tired of all the, you know, not-so-great stuff on Facebook, and they're all just great, feel-good kind of ads. So if Emily, my account manager, would ask me how many specific closings I had, you know, that came directly from Platform-

Tim Chermak:
Yeah. You're like-

Jill Lightfoot:
I don't think it was a ton.

Tim Chermak:
Yeah. You're like-

Jill Lightfoot:
But yet, my business was growing and I think I was-

Tim Chermak:
Exactly.

Jill Lightfoot:
I think that I ended that year one at around $125,000 in GCI.

Tim Chermak:
Okay. So you're like, "Okay. My business has basically doubled, and yet if someone asked me how many of those leads came from Platform, it's like, I really don't know how to answer that question because it feels like not many of them."

Jill Lightfoot:
Not many. Yeah.

Tim Chermak:
And yet also, we know that no one's business spontaneously doubles from $60,000 to $120,000 just because you randomly get more referrals that year. That's way out of the realm of like statistical possibility. Like maybe in any given year, right, if you were hovering around $60,000 a year in GCI, maybe you might have a year where randomly you do $75,000 or maybe even $80,000 because you got lucky and just, this particular year, a bunch of people randomly referred business to you, but like the next year, you might as well also go down to $55,000 in GCI because maybe that next year, randomly you received fewer referrals, right, than you did the year before.

Jill Lightfoot:
Yep, yep.

Tim Chermak:
So there's kind of this range of maybe, I don't know, 25% that your business can go up or down. Up or down, right? 25% any given year based on how many referrals you're getting, but no one's business spontaneously doubles or, in other words, goes up 100% just because randomly you got more referrals. So clearly, it's like this marketing is starting to work, and yet it's interesting that you say that, you know, your account manager at Platform asks you, "So how many of these deals can you trace back to Platform?", and you're like, "I don't really know, because I'm just getting way more phone calls and way more referrals," and that's what, at Platform, we call "fuzzy ROI."

Jill Lightfoot:
Yep.

Tim Chermak:
Right? It's over the long term. It's like, "I can't really track where those leads are coming from, but I also know that in previous years before I started this Platform strategy, I was never receiving that volume of phone calls or this many referrals," even if it's technically coming from people you sort of knew. Like, "That person has never referred someone to me before or," you know.

Jill Lightfoot:
Yeah.

Tim Chermak:
So it sounds like in 2019, which is your second year in Platform, your business doubles.

Jill Lightfoot:
Yep.

Tim Chermak:
And so now, you've basically gotten all of your money back and then some that you obviously invested to kind of launch this Platform program. If your business grows from, you know, $60,000 to $120-something, and you're creating a lot more content, you're putting out more retargeting ads. Did you attend the Platform mastermind in 2019? The one in San Antonio, I think it was?

Jill Lightfoot:
Yep.

Tim Chermak:
Okay. So you were there.

Jill Lightfoot:
Yep.

Tim Chermak:
Was that an important event or is that your first Platform mastermind?

Jill Lightfoot:
That was not my first one. 2018? Was that when we were at Disney?

Tim Chermak:
Yeah, that was at Disney. Yep.

Jill Lightfoot:
Okay. That was the first one-

Tim Chermak:
Okay, cool.

Jill Lightfoot:
That I was at. So yeah. I mean, I think it was just attending the masterminds, just doing what Emily told me to do, and then I slowly saw, you know, like everything that you told me would happen or Mitch told me what happened when we originally talked was starting to happen.

Tim Chermak:
Sure, sure.

Jill Lightfoot:
And I always believed in it. I just didn't know like, "How long can I hang on?", you know? And luckily it was, what, 18 months, maybe two years to where, yes, I doubled. So then I, here I was. You know, it was like the sky's the limit. So that's when I started to add more money into my ad budget.

Tim Chermak:
So you basically reinvested those new profits from your business and you're like, "Hey, cool. I'm going to reinvest this into running even more ads so I can kind of keep rolling that snowball even larger." So if I would ask you, Jill, to place a specific timeline on it, when do you really feel like you could, deep down, tell yourself if you're looking at yourself in the mirror, "Okay, I made the right decision. Platform is working for me," or if you were talking to your husband and you're like, "Okay, whew, sigh relief. We made the right decision here?" Was that a year in? Was it six months in? Was it 18 months in? Like how long did it take for you to really be honest with yourself and feel good about the decision to start the Platform strategy?

Jill Lightfoot:
I think it might have been closer to two years.

Tim Chermak:
Okay. So two years in.

Jill Lightfoot:
Yep. Yeah. I guess if I am really being honest and thinking back, it was that year that I broke a hundred that we were like, "Yeah," and that took took a couple years.

Tim Chermak:
So that's really important, because a lot of people get frustrated when they're four months in and they don't have a closing, or sometimes people even get seven months in and they don't have a closing. They have a ton of leads coming in or maybe they have videos that have thousands and thousands of video views. So kind of the leading indicators are there, if you will. You know, kind of the marketing metrics are showing people are clicking on your content and engaging with you, but obviously none of that matters if you don't have actual closings, right?

Jill Lightfoot:
Yeah.

Tim Chermak:
I, of all people, need to emphasize that as the CEO of a marketing company that no one cares if you're getting clicks if it's not actually translating into closings.

Jill Lightfoot:
Right. Yeah.

Tim Chermak:
And so lots of people get whatever, you know, six months in, seven months in. We've had some people go as long is eight or nine months, and they're sticking with the Platform strategy. They're trying to be faithful to it, filming their videos every month, creating retargeting content, and it takes them sometimes that long to get the first closing, and yet you're saying, "Hey, yeah, I mean, I got some closings and I was breaking even, but it took me really two years, 24 months to really feel like, 'Okay, this is paying off in a major way.'"

Tim Chermak:
So I just want to emphasize that again because that's really good perspective for people that are still in your first year, that almost in a sense, the longer you stick with this strategy, the more of a competitive advantage it becomes long-term. Like the longer it takes to work, the more of a competitive advantage it is because other agents in your market are not going to have the level of patience and vision that it takes to stick with a marketing strategy that long, because most people will try something for a month or two, and if they don't get just immediate overwhelming results, they quit because they're like, "Well, I gave it a couple months and it didn't do anything," you know, and that's their mentality, right?

Tim Chermak:
So if you embark on this platform marketing strategy, knowing that it's going to take a year or maybe even 18 months to really start paying off in a major way, that's actually an incredible competitive advantage. It's like a moat around your castle because most agents will not have the courage to stick it out. You know, most people think six months is a long time to try something.

Jill Lightfoot:
Yep.

Tim Chermak:
Right. Like, and especially if you try it for six months and think, "Oh my God, a year. I can't imagine trying something for a year." It's like, "Well, in the real world, it takes a lot longer than that to get incredible results, or else everyone would do it," right? If making $300,000 a year was as easy as just, "Oh, well, I'll sign up for this marketing program, and within 90 days, my business will be bringing in $20,000, $30,000 a month, and that'll put me on pace for $300,000 a year," if it were that easy, everyone would do it, and then ironically, if everyone would do it, it would stop working.

Jill Lightfoot:
Right. Exactly.

Tim Chermak:
Because especially in a local business like real estate, the more people start doing something, the less it's going to work, right? So the more exclusivity you have, like the more rare the marketing is that you're doing obviously, the better it's going to work. So, you should be thankful, in a sense, that it takes so long to start working because that means no one else in your area is ever going to rip you off and-

Jill Lightfoot:
Yeah-

Tim Chermak:
Copy you.

Jill Lightfoot:
Yeah. I mean, that's exactly what kept me going, is that. I knew I was the only one in Columbus doing this type of marketing. I believed in the philosophy behind all of it. I knew that putting my money elsewhere would not, you know, like you said, Zillow or wherever, realtor.com, just to get crappy leads. I could be paying the same amount and just be getting crappy leads. I wouldn't be building a brand. I wouldn't be building a database. I wouldn't be building a retargeting audience with any of that. So I knew that was not where I wanted my money, and I wanted my money here and I was willing to wait. Yes, I had moments of, I wouldn't really say frustration, just like, "Oh, I wish this was a little bit faster."

Tim Chermak:
Yeah. You're like, "I was kind of thinking I would be a success story by now."

Jill Lightfoot:
Yeah, but yet, I just knew, the belief was there and I didn't want to quit. I guess it was just the competitive nature of myself. Like I didn't want someone else taking my market.

Tim Chermak:
Yeah. Yep, yep.

Jill Lightfoot:
And I didn't want anyone else stepping in. It was like, "No. That was mine and I'm going to make it work," and that's-

Tim Chermak:
You know what's funny, is that I've had a lot of agents tell me, like, especially after they attend their first Platform mastermind, they're like, "You know, I stuck with it because the first mastermind I went to, I was one of those people who when we go around the room and we just do an introduction of ourselves, and we kind of share where our business is at or what our goals are, I was one of those people where it's like, 'Well, I'm here, and I'm really hoping to learn a lot because my business really hasn't yet taken off, and I'm hoping that it does. So I'm hoping to learn from people here who have kind of crossed the chasm and they are successful because I have not yet had the success.' I just want to stick it out so at the next mastermind, I can be one of the people who stands up and says, 'Platform has doubled my business. I'm really excited to,'" you know.

Tim Chermak:
They want to be able to say that in front of the room as kind of like this, you know, coming of age achievement, right? It's almost like a rite of passage to be able to stand up at a mastermind and say, "I'm one of the people who stuck with it, and my business has doubled," or, "My business has tripled," right?

Jill Lightfoot:
Yeah, yeah. I agree-

Tim Chermak:
And so you stuck with it. So in these first couple years, Jill, who were a couple of like the Platform heroes that you looked up to? Because I think everyone has at least a couple agents that you looked at as kind of inspiration of like, "Well, I'm really inspired by their example because of seeing their ads and knowing that their business grew and they stuck with it," or, you know, just their maybe presence in the Facebook group or meeting them at a mastermind. Are there a couple agents that immediately come to mind where you're thinking, especially the first couple years when you just had to kind of muster up the emotional courage to stick with it, that you looked up to these one or two agents as kind of like a model of success to follow?

Jill Lightfoot:
I know it's so weird to just, or so hard to pinpoint just one person or to single out a couple people, because I just feel like it was a whole collective group of people. Our Facebook group kept me motivated, and yes, meeting people face-to-face at the masterminds is priceless. That was amazing for me to network with people. We all have the same struggles. It wasn't just Jill, you know, having the same struggle, and then we would celebrate, you know, be able to celebrate each other's wins.

Jill Lightfoot:
So I guess it's hard for me to pinpoint a person here or a person there because it was just so, so many that it's just more of like a group effort, I guess, with me-

Tim Chermak:
Sure, sure. No, totally. Totally.

Jill Lightfoot:
Yeah. I needed a lot of positive feedback, or positive reinforcement, I guess is what I'm trying to say, and hearing other people's success, I just kept telling myself, "I'm just as good as they are. I just haven't been doing it as long. I just need to keep with it." That, I mean, that was really just the secret to keeping me going those first couple years, were the other agents in Platform, and you guys too. I just knew I was doing the right thing. I just needed more time.

Tim Chermak:
So if you look back at the masterminds, you've attended because if you were at Disney, when we did the Platform mastermind at Disney world in 2018, and 2019, we had the event in San Antonio, Texas. In 2020, the Platform mastermind was up in Minneapolis. At the Mall of America is where we held it. Is there a specific mastermind talk, either a specific mastermind or a specific mastermind talk, like a specific talk someone gave that really inspired you or in any way resonated with you maybe deeper than others?

Tim Chermak:
And I am putting you on the spot here because this is-

Jill Lightfoot:
No-

Tim Chermak:
Not, this is not a question I told you I would ask before the podcast. So, you did not have time to think about this-

Jill Lightfoot:
That's okay, and you're one of the speakers, Tim.

Jill Lightfoot:
All of it was amazing. Every speaker I got something different out of, even though beforehand, I would look at what they were talking about and think, "Oh, I don't know if that really applies to me or not." It did. Next person, I would think maybe the same thing. "Oh, I'm not sure I'm going to get anything out of this particular topic." It did. Really the gold, again, was after, afterwards when I got to meet the other agents and, you know, network. Like I said, just talk about our struggles, what worked for them, what worked for me. It just, it was reassuring, I guess, to me to know I wasn't in it alone. I had someone now to call, I had met them face-to-face. I know that if I need help with a certain area, I'm going to call these folks.

Tim Chermak:
Yeah. You know we actually had a podcast a couple months ago where Neil Cox talked about, he was at the point where he was, I think, you know, a year or so into Platform, and it had sort of broke even. He had a very similar story to you where, you know, he's 12 months in. He's had a couple closings. It's probably broken even, maybe not even broken even. So he's kind of like reevaluating, like, "This is a lot of money to be investing in a marketing strategy if it's only going to break, even for me," you know, because for those listening, Platform, to really do it right, probably costs somewhere between $2000 and $2500 a month once you factor in all of the advertising budgets and everything.

Tim Chermack:
So that's larger, you know, unless you're living in like a $800,000 home, that's larger than most people's mortgages every month. So it's the largest expense in your life every month, right? And so that's why it's pretty impressive that you could start Platform only having made $60,000 the year before because it wasn't like you were sitting on this big war chest of, "Oh, well I just printed money the year before, so now I can reinvest into Platform," you know, something that costs nearly $2,500 a month.

Jill Lightfoot:
Yeah.

Tim Chermak:
It takes courage to do that if you aren't sitting on a pile of money. So imagine doing this for 12 months and you've basically just broken even. That takes some serious courage to keep going. So you were actually one of those people that Neil referenced in a previous podcast episode where he was at that point where he's like, "You know, it's not that I don't like it or it's not that I don't think it's working, but I thought that 12 months in, I'd have a little bit better results by now, and I don't." So he called you-

Jill Lightfoot:
Yep.

Tim Chermak:
To ask for basically just encouragement, I guess.

Jill Lightfoot:
Yeah, yeah.

Tim Chermak:
What did that conversation go like?

Jill Lightfoot:
I mean, what was great about that is I was probably one year advanced of Neil and I knew where he was, and that was really just our conversation, was, "Oh, you're right where it started to really take off for me." Did I give him like jaw-dropping advice? No, other than I could just relate to where he was, and I just encouraged him. "Keep doing what you're doing. Film a video, and when you feel like you don't know what else to do, just film another one."

Tim Chermak:
Yeah. It's like if you're-

Jill Lightfoot:
Or just-

Tim Chermak:
If you're frustrated that all the videos you filmed haven't been working, then film more videos.

Jill Lightfoot:
Just film more. Yes. Yeah. So yeah. It was just, it was good to talk with him because I was there. I was at that same point, and he, it wasn't like he was ready to give up. He was, he just needed to know like, "Is there going to be light"-

Tim Chermak:
You need encouragement.

Jill Lightfoot:
"At the end of the tunnel?"

Tim Chermak:
Yeah, absolutely. I love these conversations. I love when different members of the Plat Fam get to connect with each other. Obviously it's fun when we can facilitate it. You know, if it's at a mastermind or something, I love being a part of those conversations too, but it's super cool when one realtor reaches out to another realtor and Platform technically isn't even in involved in that, because I think it's easy to miss that value is actually being received both ways, because it's encouraging for Neil, in this scenario, to be able to talk to you, Jill, and receive that encouragement and that, beyond the encouragement, just the perspective, right, of someone who's about a year ahead of him. "Here's the results I got because I stuck with it. So stick with it, because you're right at the point where things are probably about to start turning around and you'll get a bunch of closings."

Tim Chermak:
So it's encouraging to have that perspective, but it's also encouraging for you as the person sharing the perspective, because putting yourself back into that, you know, mindset or the emotional state that someone like Neil was in is a reminder of how far you've come, right?

Jill Lightfoot:
Yeah, yeah. It was-

Tim Chermak:
Because sometimes we forget how far we've come in our businesses, and I mean, I have this all the time where I'm talking to even agents that are making $250,000 a year and they feel stuck, and they'll call me up and they'll be like, "You know what? I just feel like my business has kind of plateaued at $250,000," and I'll kind of like reframe it. I'm like, "Dude, do you remember when you started whatever platform and you were making $90,000 a year, and now you're calling me complaining?" Not "complaining"; I don't want to make it sound like they're negative, but they're calling me frustrated that they're "stuck" or they've plateaued at $250,000. Sometimes you just need a reminder of how awesome it is that these are your problems now.

Jill Lightfoot:
Yeah. I mean it was just so weird to me that I was like, "Wait. I'm at the point where someone's reaching out to me for advice? Okay," and then you just made me realize, "Oh, well, yeah, because I have doubled." It was just so slow. It wasn't like a big wham, you know, smack in the face kind of thing that I was at the point where I could encourage someone else. It's very true. I didn't really think of that until Neil had called me, and now Neil's rocking it and he stuck with it, and-

Tim Chermak:
Yeah. Now, I mean, now we did a Platform podcast interview with Neil because his business has grown. Your business has grown. That's really cool. So that basically led us into 2019. How did things go for you in 2020, which was a really crazy year, obviously, in real estate with all of the COVID and lockdowns and all that. How did things go for you in 2020, which would've been your third year?

Jill Lightfoot:
Yeah, I mean, it was my best year ever, despite we were a state that was really locked down too. I didn't have a closing for three months, I would say, of 2020, and still ended up being my best year. Hired an assistant. I was getting a little crazy and needed some help, and yeah. I mean, it's just, it's insane that even during that, I still grew and I was, I think last year I closed close to like $250,000-ish.

Tim Chermak:
In GCI. Yep.

Jill Lightfoot:
GCI, yeah.

Tim Chermak:
So again, like your business basically doubled from the previous year where you were, you know, obviously excited to make about $120,000, $125,000 that year because that meant your business had doubled. Now in 2020, your business doubles again from $120-something to like $250,000. So now you're able to look back and be like, "Oh, it's actually kind of funny I was ever stressed out about signing up for Platform, because now I've gone from $60,000 to $250,000. So you're basically making an extra $200,000 a year that you weren't making before.

Jill Lightfoot:
It's true-

Tim Chermak:
Like it's almost funny to think that we were ever then stressed out about spending a couple thousand dollars a month, when now you're making an extra $200,000 a year that you weren't making before.

Jill Lightfoot:
Yes.

Tim Chermak:
But you just have to stick it out long enough to get to that point, right?

Tim Chermak:
It's like if a, you know, farmer plant seeds in the spring. Like it can kind of feel, you know, once you get to August, late August, it's like, "Wow. That corn has been in the field a long time, and I see it growing, but I haven't made any money on it yet," right? Like imagine just abandoning your field at the end of August just because, "Well, I haven't made any money yet." It's like, "Well dude, just stick with that another month, and you can harvest in late September or early October, and that's when you'll make all the money, but you just need to stick with it long enough for the natural cycle to complete," right?

Tim Chermak:
Marketing is a lot like farming in that if you want to make more money in farming, you have to plant more seeds, but that doesn't change the timeline, right? Like-

Jill Lightfoot:
Right.

Tim Chermak:
If someone spends, let's say $100,000 dollars on planting in April versus someone who spends $250,000 planting in April, the person who spends $250,000 is not going to get faster results. It doesn't change the timeline, right? It just means that when the results start pouring in, they'll have a lot more results, but it doesn't necessarily mean it's going to come faster. I think a lot of agents get confused on that because they're thinking like, "Well I'm spending so much money on this. I would've thought I would've had results faster." It still takes time, right? And so many people get discouraged. They're only three, four, or five months in, right, when if all they did was just stick with it like you did, like Neil did, like so many other people have done even before you in Platform, you get to this incredible point where now I think it would be accurate to say it, and I don't want to put words in your mouth, but it would be accurate to say like you're making life-changing amounts of money. I mean-

Jill Lightfoot:
Sure.

Tim Chermak:
It changes your family's life, and I know it's maybe a dramatic thing to say, but I would say if your income all of a sudden grows consistently, you know, where it's not like you just had one lucky year, but consistently you go from $60,000 to now this year, you're going to make nearly $300,000. So you are almost bringing in now an extra quarter million dollars a year that you didn't have before that radically changes your family's day-to-day life, I guess, right?

Jill Lightfoot:
Yeah.

Tim Chermak:
I mean-

Jill Lightfoot:
Yeah.

Tim Chermak:
It means-

Jill Lightfoot:
100%.

Tim Chermak:
Yeah. Like it means when you go out to eat, you're not looking at prices on the menu anymore, or it's like, "Hey, if I want to get the expensive bottle of wine, I can do it and not think about it," or you can put money away for, you know, vacations in the future, more for retirement.

Tim Chermak:
So let me actually ask you a kind of personal question. Like what have you started doing differently in your personal life in terms of how you spend or invest money that you couldn't afford to do before?

Jill Lightfoot:
Well, the biggest one, and that would, if we can fast forward to this year-

Tim Chermak:
Sure, sure.

Jill Lightfoot:
Is that okay? So if we fast forward to this year, 2021, my husband has been at his chained-to-the-desk job for the last 20-some years, and super burnout. COVID made his job super hard, super stressful. Lots of hours sitting here in our basement where he just got completely burnt out, and we felt like that we were in a great spot with my business. I felt like for the first time, and you don't really feel this a whole lot in real estate, that I had control over what I could be doing and what I could be making.

Jill Lightfoot:
So the end of the summer, we knew that we wanted to transition him out of there. So what I did after listening to one of the podcasts, I decided to put more money into my marketing. I actually doubled it from $1000 to $2000 in my ad budget.

Tim Chermak:
So you are now spending-

Jill Lightfoot:
Knowing-

Tim Chermak:
You're now spending $2,000 a month on the actual advertising budget.

Jill Lightfoot:
Yes. Yeah, because I knew what that was going to do. I knew that that then meant it wouldn't be so hard for him to transition out of his job.

Tim Chermak:
Okay. So let me actually provide some additional context here because I just want to make sure that everyone is understanding exactly what you're saying from like a mathematical perspective. You are now investing $2,000 a month into the actual advertising budget, but that's on top of, obviously, the Platform marketing fee that you're paying. So really, you're investing over $3,000 every month, probably actually pretty close to, I mean, at this point, if you annualize it, it's probably pretty close to $40,000 a year into your marketing.

Jill Lightfoot:
Yep.

Tim Chermak:
Because you can afford to, and you're realizing like, "Well, if last year, if I was only spending a thousand dollars a month on ads and that thousand dollars a month created $300,000 in GCI, well, my business should grow proportionally more if I start spending $2,000 a month versus a thousand," and now you're in a financial position where you can actually be like, "Yeah, sure, whatever. I'll spend that extra thousand dollars a month on this."

Jill Lightfoot:
Yep.

Tim Chermak:
And it's not really scary once you just look at the numbers. You're like, "Oh my God. I can actually afford to do that. That's not even that big of a risk."

Jill Lightfoot:
Yep. I knew what it was going to produce. So we decided to do this, I think it was towards, maybe it was midsummer. July, August. I can't really remember.

Tim Chermak:
So you're about three or four months into this experiment now of spending substantially more money on ads.

Jill Lightfoot:
Yes.

Tim Chermak:
What has happened in the last couple months in your business?

Jill Lightfoot:
Yeah. So I, just this fall, I would say from last month, so October until the end of the year, we will have almost 15 closings. I have definitely replaced, just in those months, my husband's income.

Tim Chermak:
So you are now making enough money in your business just in these last several months that-

Jill Lightfoot:
Yeah.

Tim Chermak:
The fact that your husband quit his job doesn't even affect your family's finances because your real estate business has grown even since then enough to replace his annual income.

Jill Lightfoot:
Yep. I just had to have the courage to put that extra money in there, but I already knew. I already knew it was going to work. So I just did it, and then yeah-

Tim Chermak:
So you have-

Jill Lightfoot:
Our fall had been crazy.

Tim Chermak:
You said you have about 15 closings from here to the end of the year?

Jill Lightfoot:
Yeah, yeah. Mm-hmm.

Tim Chermak:
And each of those, I mean, what's the medium price point in your area that you're typically working in?

Jill Lightfoot:
$300Ks.

Tim Chermak:
So it would be fair to say each closing is, I mean, approximately worth $10,000 to you, or $8,000, 9,000. Like what does it typically end up being?

Jill Lightfoot:
After I pay my transaction coordinator and my assistant, I would say probably like $8,000.

Tim Chermak:
$8,000. Okay, cool. So if you have 15 deals closing just between now and the end of the year, I mean that's over a hundred thousand dollars.

Jill Lightfoot:
Yeah, yeah.

Tim Chermak:
Right there.

Jill Lightfoot:
I think that figure I gave you, or I didn't give you a specific figure, but when I figured it, I took out that 20% that I pay my assistants, and I was still, I'm still able to replace his income just the last little bit of this year-

Tim Chermak:
And again, that's just, those are the closings that you've created before the end of the year, and again, I want to emphasize, Jill's in Columbus, Ohio, which obviously is a four-season area of the country that has a cold winter and everything. So if you're making basically a hundred grand in GCI, just in Q4 of this year, that means that next year when the spring and summer market comes, I mean, you are going to be absolutely on fire. Your business might be at $400,000 or $500,000 in GCI-

Jill Lightfoot:
That's the goal.

Tim Chermak:
By then. Yeah, yeah.

Jill Lightfoot:
Yep. That's our goal for next year.

Tim Chermak:
And you started at $60,000 in GCI.

Jill Lightfoot:
Yep, yep.

Tim Chermak:
So, I mean, that's like a generational wealth building. Like you are setting up a financial foundation to where you're going to be a multimillionaire in retirement and your kids will probably be millionaires if you just save and invest that money even remotely conservatively.

Jill Lightfoot:
Yep, yep. Yeah. I mean, it's just-

Tim Chermak:
That's pretty cool.

Jill Lightfoot:
It's just sticking with it, even when you're discouraged or you're frustrated. I guess I always felt like, "I've got to keep going, because what if I quit this month and this is the month where it was all going to kind of open up for me and see all of the payback?" I think that's the conversation that Neil and I had, was just, "Not yet." Like, "Just keep going, just keep going," and that's just what always was in the back of my mind, was like, "No, I have to keep pushing myself. I know this will eventually pay off," and you know, and here I am and it has. It's just, the amount of control, I guess, that I can have over my business now is crazy to me, because like I said, that's just not something that you have hardly at all in real estate. You just don't. And I know if I spend more money or if I do this, if I do that, Tim has helped me, other agents have helped me learn how to grow my business, that I can, and-

Tim Chermak:
Yeah. You actually feel a sense of autonomy and control over, "Oh, if I spend X, I can create Y in income." Like there's actually a relationship between those two numbers now versus just spending money and hoping that at some point-

Jill Lightfoot:
Exactly-

Tim Chermak:
Hoping at some point-

Jill Lightfoot:
Throwing up a billboard-

Tim Chermak:
In the distance future, yeah-

Jill Lightfoot:
Throwing money into this, throwing money into that. Yeah.

Tim Chermak:
I mean, framed differently, Jill, if you think about it like this, this is nuts. You're going to have more GCI in just Q4 of this year to pay for five years of Platform is money. That's going to be coming in just the next 90 days.

Jill Lightfoot:
Yeah. Yep. Mm-hmm.

Tim Chermak:
For five years of Platform, to keep this marketing going. I mean, that's amazing.

Jill Lightfoot:
It is amazing, and it's just not even the money part of it. The money is amazing, yes. I'm not going to say that. I'm not going to say that it's not, but just when I really started thinking about how it has affected other people, like my husband, that's amazing for him to be out of that stressful, dull environment. Even just the two assistants that I have helping me, you know, one of them newer agent, just needs a little bit of help getting going. Him helping me has helped him. Just this platform has changed his life and his career. Same with my transaction coordinator. She was an agent, but didn't really enjoy a whole lot of the real estate part, but loved the transaction part, and because of Platform, I was able to let her do that. That has changed her life. You know, so it's just-

Tim Chermak:
And she's making-

Jill Lightfoot:
It's not just me.

Tim Chermak:
She's making a lot more money now because I'm imagine you're paying her per transaction.

Jill Lightfoot:
Yep.

Tim Chermak:
And obviously there's a hell of a lot more transactions going on right now than there were several years ago. So, that's-

Jill Lightfoot:
Yeah.

Tim Chermak:
That's super cool.

Jill Lightfoot:
No, it's just amazing. Just the, yes, I love the money, but I love the stories of the other people as well. I mean, to me, that's almost so much satisfaction to me.

Tim Chermak:
Yeah, yep. What are maybe one or two of your favorite ads or videos that you've done over the last several years that you know they were working specifically because people in real life told you that, "Oh, I saw such-and-such video," or, "Oh, I saw the ad that you did." Are there maybe one or two that come to mind where you know a lot of people saw them because they were actually telling you in real life that they saw such-and-such video?

Jill Lightfoot:
I think it was really, Tim, just the retargeting personal moment ads. You know, I would have people say, "Oh, I saw you were just at the Biltmore castle," or, "I saw you and Jane were taking a hike." Jane is my daughter. So if I were just to look at the ad, if I were to go on Facebook and look at the ad and be like, "Oh, well not a whole lot of people commented on this," I don't really know if a whole lot of people saw it in the number if I looked at the actual numbers.

Tim Chermak:
It's that fuzzy ROI.

Jill Lightfoot:
Yeah. It was just that, and I would have, you know, people commenting more on those type things than me telling them a video of "let me explain closing costs"-

Tim Chermak:
Yeah. Sure, sure, sure.

Jill Lightfoot:
You know, or telling you what the market here in Columbus, Ohio is like.

Tim Chermak:
Yeah, the actual stuff that has to do with real estate. No one really resonates with that. No one cares, but you have to put enough of that stuff out there. So people know that you're a talented, knowledgeable realtor, but what, what really resonates with them is the more personal retargeting content. I think that's the strength of the Platform strategy, is that you get that stuff on steroids.

Jill Lightfoot:
Yep, and just don't look at, "Oh, well, nobody commented on it. So I don't think that was really successful." Like, no. That's not it. I had to get that out of my mind really quick, because I would think, "Why am I doing this? It just seems like nobody really cares." You have no idea the impact you're having, and don't just get too caught up in how many views you had or how many comments you had or whatever. It's just so subliminal and slow. It's amazing. I just, yeah.

Tim Chermak:
Well, if-

Jill Lightfoot:
I don't know what to say.

Tim Chermak:
If there's ever a story of why you need to stick with it and have the long haul mentality and that long-term perspective, Jill Lightfoot's story should encourage you. So if you're listening to this, if you're discouraged, if you're frustrated, or if you're just starting and you need to kind of prepare yourself for those times where you get discouraged, listen to this podcast episode, re-listen to this podcast episode, because I think this one is super, super encouraging. So Jill, thank you. Thank you for joining us on this. I know that obviously with all these transactions you're now doing, your time is very valuable. So thank you for sharing this with us and-

Jill Lightfoot:
You're welcome.

Tim Chermak:
I will see you in just a couple weeks at the next Platform mastermind.

Jill Lightfoot:
Can't wait! Can't wait. Thanks, Tim.