What To Do If You're A Realtor In A Small Town

Heather Mutz:
I will say your business changes from buyers to sellers as you are with Platform, and we all know that we'd much rather be listing homes than running around buyers everywhere, so it's huge. It is huge, the way your business will shift and you just have people calling you. You're not out hunting for business.

Tim Chermak:
This is the Platform Marketing Show where we interview the most creative and ambitious real estate agents in the country, dissect their local marketing strategy and get the behind the scenes scoop on how they're generating listing leads and warm referrals. We'll dive into the specifics of what marketing campaigns are working for them, how much they're spending on those campaigns and figure out how they have perfected what we call, the Platform Marketing Strategy. This is your host, Tim Chermak. I'm the founder and CEO of Platform. I love marketing and I talk too much, so let's dive in.

Tim Chermak:
Hey guys, and welcome back to another episode of the Platform Marketing Show. This episode is kind of special. It's a group conversation, so I'm not just having an interview with one real estate agent. We actually have three realtors on here that are implementing the Platform program in their local market and what they all have in common. We have Heather Mutz, Taylor Onken and Ashley Goodrich. They're all in small towns and when I say small towns, I don't mean an outer suburb of a big city. I mean, small towns for all intents and purposes in the middle of nowhere. Heather is in Hondo, in Medina County, Texas. It's about 45 minutes an hour away from San Antonio. So it's a small town. I mean, it's very, very rural. I think Heather, Hondo has what, 8,000 people?

Heather Mutz:
8,000 people. Yeah.

Tim Chermak:
Yeah. So very small town. Taylor is near Marshall, Minnesota, Lion County, Murray County and I think her entire county or I mean, both those counties combined only have 20,000-30,000 people, something like that. So lots of farmland and nothing there in-

Taylor Onken:
Rocks and cows.

Tim Chermak:
Yeah. The rocks and cows region of Southwest Minnesota as the governor said. Then, Ashley is in Spearfish, South Dakota, also an extremely small town. I think it's like 10,000-15,000 people, way in Western South Dakota, kind of up in the Black Hills and Spearfish is in Lawrence County. Again, the entire region that Ashley might drive in a half hour direction, any way, only has what, 20,000 - 30,000 people.

Ashley Goodrich:
Yes, I would say the closest larger city is approximately an hour away, which would be Rapid City, South Dakota, but yes, Spearfish, South Dakota is in the Black Hills and it's yeah, about 20,000-

Tim Chermak:
It's a small town. Yeah.

Ashley Goodrich:
Yeah.

Tim Chermak:
Yeah. I mean, all of you in your small towns have like traditional kind of quaint main streets where there's still like local shops and businesses. It's like the quintessential small town America that we remember from main street USA, Walt Disney. That's all of your towns. You're in small-

Ashley Goodrich:
Very much so.

Tim Chermak:
Yes.

Ashley Goodrich:
The old school buildings, the old banks, 1900, the old buildings that we're trying to kind of keep alive and things like that. The opera houses, things like that. Yes, very much.

Tim Chermak:
Yup, and so all of them are small towns. The other point I want to make is that these are not just small towns that are right next to a big city, because I think some people trick themselves into thinking that they're in a small town, but really they're just 10, 15 minutes outside of a major metro area, that has a lot of population. Again, for both ... I mean, Heather, the nearest town, San Antonio is still basically an hour away. Taylor, I mean the nearest town for you is, is it Sioux Falls? I mean, what is the big-

Taylor Onken:
Yeah. Sioux falls or Mankato, an hour and a half, either way probably.

Tim Chermak:
Yeah, and Mankato is not a big city either. So you're 90 minutes from civilization, essentially. Ashley, like the biggest town is Rapid City and Rapid City isn't even a big city, it's just the nearest town that's bigger than where you are and that's still an hour away.

Ashley Goodrich:
It has Sam's Club, that kind of thing.

Tim Chermak:
Yeah. Exactly. It's like-

Ashley Goodrich:
And all the Target.

Tim Chermak:
Yeah, like, "Oh, we have to make a Target run. It's an hour drive throughout the city." Yeah.

Ashley Goodrich:
Yup. Let's go to Sam's Club today. Sunday afternoon.

Tim Chermak:
So I'm also from a small town in the Midwest, a small town in Minnesota that had 20,000 people. So I think that experience growing up, has definitely shaped a lot of the ads and just the overall cultural philosophy of how we do marketing at Platform is because that's my background too. That's my experience too, is living and growing up in a small town. So what we're going to discuss on this podcast episode is how to build a brand and how to be a successful real estate agent using the Platform strategy specifically if you're in a small town. So Heather, I want to start with you because we actually interviewed you on the Platform podcast about a year ago and you have this really cool story of growing your business with Platform, but we recorded that a year ago and I think ... I mean, you did what, 10 or 12 million a year ago was ... right?

Heather Mutz:
I finished out at 8.5 when we recorded that.

Tim Chermak:
Okay. So you were super excited about that though, obviously, because that's a lot of production.

Heather Mutz:
Totally.

Tim Chermak:
And you used to be a teacher, making like $40,000 a year. Now, as of this point, we are recording this towards the end of April in 2022 and you're already at 12 million closed and under contract, 12 million in April. We're basically halfway or not even halfway through the year and again, just several years ago, you were a teacher making like $40,000 a year and I mean-

Ashley Goodrich:
That's awesome, by the way.

Tim Chermak:
Yeah.

Ashley Goodrich:
Thank you.

Tim Chermak:
Yeah. It's incredible. So what has changed in your business in the last couple years and what thoughts would you share about how Platform has helped you build a brand in your small town?

Heather Mutz:
So when people ask, what are you doing? This is what I'm doing. I can ... Platform a program and filming videos and partnering with small businesses, and it has totally paid off for me. The partnerships I have formed in this little town ... just this year, for example, one of our small business owners, she owns a boutique. I've closed 1.5 million with her just this year. I've featured her business multiple times over the last three years, and it was building that trust and building that relationship. Then, when it came time for her to need somebody for her real estate needs, I was the person that was top of mind, and it's so fun to network and meet all of these business owners.

Heather Mutz:
So while yes, it's benefiting your business, you're also building great friendships and relationships. So, after doing 8.5 million, then this last year, a year later, I was doing 15 million now, I'm at 12, not even halfway through the year. So I'm almost doubling my business every year. All I can say is that I've consistently been shooting videos, partnering with small businesses and staying top of mind with this community. Before I was ever busy ... and I'm sure you guys got this too, before I was ever busy, when I was doing all the videos, people would see me in the grocery store or at the post office and they'd say, "Oh my gosh, you are killing it. You are so busy." And I'm thinking, "Oh yeah, I am. I am super busy."

Tim Chermak:
I'm trying to make it look like I'm busy, so I'm glad I tricked you.

Heather Mutz:
Yeah, but that's when I knew immediately, this is working. So, I'm the person that they think is doing all the business here and it ends up happening, because this is how it works.

Tim Chermak:
I hope Steph Fortman is listening to this podcast episode, because I actually just had a quick phone call with Steph yesterday. Steph is our Platform agent who focuses on the Laramie, Wyoming market. I've got to know her and her husband Brian, because I spent about six weeks living in Laramie, Wyoming last summer just for shits and giggles because I wanted to experience Wyoming. So I got to know them, I went out to eat a couple times, hung out with their kids at their flag football games and stuff. Steph ended up signing up for Platform over the winter and she's born and raised in Laramie, so she knows the area super well.

Tim Chermak:
So she's at that point right now, exactly what you just described, Heather, where I talked to her on the phone yesterday just to check in and see how things were going. She's like, "Oh, everywhere I go, people are telling me, I'm seeing your videos. I'm seeing you on social media." She hasn't yet gotten a lot of closing. She can track back to Platform, but she has several videos that have like 15,000, 20,000. One of her videos that she featured, small businesses in her area got 40,000 views. Laramie only has 25,000 people. So that means every adult in Laramie has seen that particular video actually multiple times. So everyone around town is talking about Steph Fortman and how all over social media she is.

Tim Chermak:
It's not like you get a bunch of closings the first month. It takes a while for it to really kick in. So I'm really excited for her. Hopefully this spring and summer is that turning point when all of a sudden all of that top of mind awareness and that brand translates into actual appointments and closings because you're right, there is a period of time where you're building that brand, you're filming the videos, you're featuring those local small businesses and you're putting content out there, but you're not necessarily seeing closings yet, where people ... Yeah and I think it's-

Ashley Goodrich:
I absolutely agree with that because I remember walking through Walmart a couple years ago or something and I kindly just asked this woman for help. She was just working and I was looking for something very specific and I said, "Hey, can you help me really quick?" And she wasn't even looking and she helped me out. Then, she looked up at me and she was like, "Hey, you're that girl on Facebook?" And I said, "Oh, I'm like, is that a good thing?" She goes, "Oh, it's great. I love to see your videos." And I had never met her. We sat there and had a great conversation and she was the sweetest lady. Her name was actually Sarah.

Ashley Goodrich:
She was like 54 years old, she's been here her whole life. She's like, "I think it's great. I think what you're doing is fantastic for Spearfish." It just made me feel good to ... a local person that's been here her whole life, and she thought it was really cool, what I was doing. So it was almost like, just helping out the community. It was very, very fulfilling.

Tim Chermak:
Yeah. You said it happened at Safeway too recently, where someone recognized you at the grocery store.

Ashley Goodrich:
Yes. I mean, and we do live in a small town. So everywhere we go, we're kind of ... but more so, and I remember in the beginning with the agents that you were just talking about, in the beginning, they'll start to kind of be noticed or seen, and then, like Heather is saying, the snowball effect kind of happens and they go, "You should try calling that, Ashley. She seems really involved." I'll have random people and I'll ask them, "If you don't mind me asking, where did you hear about me," or whatever, and they'll just say, "So and so saw a video or I saw a video," and I would say a lot of the business that I do now is referral base, which I'm very grateful for. Also, I would say also, the other 90%, I mean, half of it is Platform marketing.

Tim Chermak:
Yeah.

Ashley Goodrich:
It's the videos people are seeing.

Heather Mutz:
I'm convinced that even our referral based business, we're getting those referrals because we're staying top of mind. I think it all just works together. I can't even track Platform leads anymore because I think it's like a way. It's just like a way of doing things that is making us top of mind.

Taylor Onken:
Yeah, yeah. Absolutely. There's a lot of people who I haven't even done transactions with, that I've been sent numerous referrals because they're like, "Oh, you should call Taylor Onken," because they see the videos and everything keeps on popping up on their Facebook page or however they see me. So it's not even people that I have done business with-

Tim Chermak:
And Taylor, you're a newer realtor. So you are building this from scratch.

Taylor Onken:
Yup.

Tim Chermak:
I actually just found out this fact, right before we started recording, I had no idea how successful you'd become in the last year. So I knew you were doing well, hence why I invited you to share your story on the podcast, because I want to share successful stories of people who are using the Platform strategy, but I didn't realize you were doing this well. So we interviewed Taylor about a year ago on the Platform Podcast because she was one of those stories where just things started with a bang. The first month she signed up for Platform, she literally got four listings from the Platform ads in her very first month that she could directly track to Platform. So I was like, "Holy cow, we've got to have you on the podcast. That's obviously, incredible results."

Heather Mutz:
Yeah. That's nice.

Tim Chermak:
"That'll be really inspiring for people to hear how you did that." At the time, she wasn't even a full-time agent. She still had a full-time job working in city government. So that was her full-time job, nine to five and then, she was a part-time agent. So it only took a month or two of being with Platform to realize, "Okay, I have to quit my job and go all in on real estate because with the amount of leads that are coming in, there is just no way I can do this part-time anymore." So she did, but what's happened in the last year is that Taylor has built such a brand in her small town and the greater county area that she's in Southwest Minnesota.

Tim Chermak:
That she went from being a part-time agent, selling just several homes a year, several transactions, a year type deal while having a full-time job, to her first year as a full-time agent, Taylor did 50 sides last year.

Heather Mutz:
That is fantastic.

Taylor Onken:
That's crazy, right?

Tim Chermak:
Yeah, and that's in a tough market too. So I want add an asterisk on that because if someone is listening to this podcast episode, I don't know, four or five years from now, maybe the market is healthy and balanced four or five years from now. People are going to forget that the year 2021 was still in the middle of all the COVID lockdowns and low inventory, it was a hard year to be a real estate agent in 2021. That was your first trial by fire, first full-time year as a realtor, and you just dove all in, implemented the Platform strategy, created tons of content, film videos. You basically just did what we told you to do you.

Heather Mutz:
You killed it. You tell-

Tim Chermak:
Yeah, you followed the recipe and it worked.

Taylor Onken:
Well, and I mean, my call is like, this is a lot different than we see with most people because typically, they have to do the lead gen and do that. We actually had to shut my lead gen off for quite a while, so that I could keep up with what I already got going.

Ashley Goodrich:
That's actually what happened to me a few years ago, I called Tim and Emily and I said, "You guys, I can't even keep up with this," and we did, we had to turn it off and for a minute, I mean for a little while, just so I could keep it going.

Tim Chermak:
Catch up. Yeah.

Heather Mutz:
I think a lot of people initially think, "Oh, I want to do Platform for the leads. It's about building a brand." When you start building that brand for yourself, you almost don't even need the leads, that's the sprinkles on top." If you have time for it, because-

Taylor Onken:
Yup, exactly.

Ashley Goodrich:
That's exactly-

Tim Chermak:
I said, so I should probably at this point, we're already whatever, a 10, 15 minutes into the podcast, I should probably introduce all of you and share where you're at in your business, so people know who they're hearing from. So I said, Heather is in Texas, your business this year is on pace to probably do 20 million plus in a small town in Texas. Ashley was in Spearfish and Ashley, what was your business production last year? What was your volume you did?

Ashley Goodrich:
Goodness. I should really know this. I want to say ... "Well, I know that I did at least 82 sides." I was the number two single agent in South Dakota for the RE/MAX network. That was pretty exciting, but I don't know exactly what my production ... well, I should, but I don't. I think-

Tim Chermak:
Yeah. I mean, it was, you said 80 sides, 80.

Ashley Goodrich:
80.

Tim Chermak:
Okay. That's incredible. Again, in a small town and you're like the number two-

Ashley Goodrich:
I'm just a single agent, I don't have ... I'm probably a lot like those of Heather and Taylor, I don't have an assistant or anything. I have a wonderful office staff that's fantastic, but I'm just-

Tim Chermak:
Right, but you do not have a team or a full-time executive assistant or manager or anything like that.

Ashley Goodrich:
No.

Tim Chermak:
So that's absolutely incredible, and it's even more incredible that Ashley is like the number two producing RE/MAX agent in South Dakota, because most people listening to this are probably not experts in the geography of South Dakota, so let me enlighten you all. There are not big towns in South Dakota, like big, big cities. Ashley is in a very small town in South Dakota. So South Dakota obviously has like ... Rapid City has what, 100, 150,000 people in the greater area. Sioux Falls has I think a quarter million people, and the fact that you're the number two producing RE/MAX agent in the entire state, and yet, you're in a tiny town that only has like 20,000 people in the entire county, that means that you're obviously extremely successful.

Ashley Goodrich:
Well, thank you.

Tim Chermak:
So that's awesome and then, Taylor, we were just mentioning is in Southwest, Minnesota, closed over 50 sides last year. Even it was like her first year, really full time as an agent, using the Platform strategy, so these are the three we have on the podcast today. They're all absolutely killing it in their small towns. So Heather, let me go back to you, because I think of the three we have on here, Heather Taylor and Ashley, you've been working with Platform the longest. Looking back, what are some of the most successful ads or your favorite videos that you've done, whether they're photo ads or videos, actually, what ads have seemed to work the best in your small town to build a brand?

Tim Chermak:
I'm specifically asking about building a brand because we all know lead generation is great, it's fun, but what ads have helped you build a brand where people in the community reference that video or they thank you for making that ad where it got word of mouth buzz in the community? What are some of your favorite ads looking back over the last several years?

Heather Mutz:
So my all time favorite was, "God made a small business owner." We were able to feature, I want to say like 10 to 12 businesses. It was some work, right? I had a ... meet me at every business, but I met so many business owners.

Tim Chermak:
Yup.

Heather Mutz:
And I mean, I think we had over 120,000 views, like hundreds of shares. It's been ... and it's still, I love when we turn it on and run it because it's one of those warm and fuzzy, heartfelt video ads that features so many amazing businesses, and it was amazing. It was so, so cool.

Tim Chermak:
That's a very common answer, we get on the Platform shows, people saying the video, so God made a small business owner, got so much views. What are some other ads that you've done, maybe they're photo ads or ... that just have seemed to get a lot of engagement in your community.

Heather Mutz:
So the ads that I do that are in front of hometown signs, I had one where I was pulling a suitcase in front of our ... we have a sign in our town that says, this is God's country. Don't drive through it like hell and it's kind of ... it's really famous. So, I pulled some suitcases in front of it and said, "Pack your bags and get to Medina County. Here's the reasons to me move to Medina county." There was a little controversy in it, I would say but more than anything was the support of, "Oh my gosh, I love Medina County. I grew up there. I mean, just all this buzz, all these shares," and it was just a still picture ad that took me no time to run, run, get and that was great.

Heather Mutz:
Again, I think it created like a memory kind of thing and a feelings and you're great at that, Tim. I love the ideas that we get, and I think if you run with it and execute it and get it on your calendar and put it in your schedule, it's paid off every time for me, every time.

Tim Chermak:
Taylor, how about you? What are some of your most successful ads that you've done in the last year, where again, maybe not necessarily just lead generation, but ads that seem to get a lot of positive feedback from the community where you know that people liked the ad because they maybe told you in real life, "Oh, I love that photo or that video," or whatever. So what are some of your favorites?

Taylor Onken:
So I was kind of looking back at that the other day. We did one last summer, it was called, "Five Reasons That I'm Not The Agent For You." And it just really speaks to different people that I'm not there to please every single person, I'm there to more so do my job and be a real estate agent, that I'll tell you what the market support is not the number that you want to hear. Different things like that. That was one of the more unique ones, that wasn't really featuring a business. However, it was just something, catchy and it grabbed the attention of a lot of viewers-

Tim Chermak:
It's kind of like reverse psychology of five reasons, you might not want to work with me. Yup.

Taylor Onken:
Yup, and people are more apt to listen to it instead of be like, "Oh, here's five reasons you want to work with me?" The shopping cart ad was a really good one for me. It shows kind of who I am, who your kids are, and it helps people to feel like they get to know that-

Ashley Goodrich:
That was a great one.

Tim Chermak:
What is the shopping cart ad for those people listening, who have no idea what you're talking about?

Taylor Onken:
So basically mine was a photo of my oldest kid. We were at Runnings and he was pushing the cart back and it just talked about how proud I was of him and that I try to teach my kids to do the right thing and liberty requires responsibility, is what we had said. It just says, the world needs more leaders, and that was kind of the gist of the ad.

Tim Chermak:
Don't be the shitty person that leaves your cart in the middle of the parking lot. Teach your kids to bring the cart back to the cart return. Something as simple as that. I think everyone knows that morally, intuitively deep down, but putting that into an ad and then having a picture of one of your kids, pushing the cart back, taps into that sense where people immediately know what you're talking about when they see the ad, and they're like, "Oh, I've always thought that, but I've never put that into words." I think that's how you can describe any great Platform retargeting ad is when we kind of capture that lightning in a bottle where it's like, your ad says something that people have always been thinking, but they've never seen it put into words before.

Tim Chermak:
Then, you pop up in their newsfeed with that message and they're like, "Oh cool. Taylor seems like someone I would want to work with, or Ashley seems like someone I would want to work with, or Heather seems like someone I would want to work with." I mean, that's really the Platform retargeting philosophy right there in a nutshell.

Taylor Onken:
Yeah, and I do have to agree with Heather too, the eight reasons to pack your bags and move here. That was a great ad for me as well and it just, again, positions you to be the local expert in your area, whether it's completely about real estate or just the area in general, and then, they're going to go to you. So that's where it was ... I really liked that ad ... that was-

Tim Chermak:
You did 50 transactions last year in your very first year as a full-time agent. What percentage of those transactions do you think came from fuzzy ROI? Where did most of those transactions come from, if you can try to figure out in hindsight how you got so much business in one year.

Heather Mutz:
That's amazing.

Tim Chermak:
Because I mean, to be clear, there's agents who have been realtors for 10 years, that have never even done 30 or 40, and you did 50 in your very first year. So do you think a lot of them came from those social media campaigns or seeing those videos or posts or how did that happen?

Taylor Onken:
Yeah. Absolutely. I've asked ... typically when I do meet with clients, who just call me randomly? I said, "Oh, just ... where'd you hear about me or how'd you get my number or whatever type of a thing." Definitely over half, I'd say probably, at least 70 to 80% of people came from seeing me on Facebook or my videos, or I love your marketing, type of a thing. Then, the others were probably more so repeat clients or a newspaper ad here or there, that I had did to support the local newspapers and what not.

Tim Chermak:
So I actually ... I randomly know the mayor of Hendricks, Minnesota, just because ... and Hendricks, is it 45 minutes away from where you are? I don't know. Yeah.

Taylor Onken:
Yeah.

Tim Chermak:
It's a tiny, tiny town like near the border of South Dakota and Minnesota. The only reason I know him is because we were both kind of like volunteer activists on the Ron Paul campaign when Ron Paul ran for president. So, we met each other through politics because I was super passionate about Ron Paul when he ran and he ended up becoming the mayor of Hendricks a couple years ago, whatever. So, he sent me a Facebook message the other week saying like, "Hey Tim, I know that you do real estate marketing. Is there any chance that you work with Taylor Onken because she has absolutely blown up in the last year and everyone here is talking about her and she just seems to be like the talk of the town, and I wonder if she hired Tim's company," and he was totally right. Taylor is working with Platform Marketing. I was like, that's kind of a cool connection, because-

Heather Mutz:
It's so funny how they ... I went to a wedding this weekend and I saw a girl that was my client a few years ago and she doesn't live here and she's like, "Oh my gosh, it's Miss Hondo." I mean, you just become the little local celebrity and it's like a little bit embarrassing. You're like, I mean, yeah, I guess you've been seeing my video.

Taylor Onken:
Yes. No, it's funny, because Hendricks is actually my mom's hometown. She grew up there, and then, ever since I started Platform, especially, I've gotten a lot of commercial property listings and whatnot, which I love too. So, I listed a commercial property over there and we did a great video for them and yeah, that one blew up. So it was good.

Tim Chermak:
So Ashley, you're in Spearfish, South Dakota. Again, small town. You've been working a Platform for basically several years now and actually, I just used Ashley as my realtor to buy some land at Spearfish because I visited Spearfish for the first time a couple years ago, absolutely fell in love with it. It's like this gorgeous small town in the mountains of Western South Dakota, the Black Hills. I just thought it was the most beautiful place ever. It's not yet discovered, like Bozeman became super popular in the last 10 years in Montana or the old Colorado resort towns that everyone's heard of, like Aspen and Vail.

Tim Chermak:
I feel like Spearfish is the next Aspen, Vail or Bozeman, but people haven't yet discovered Spearfish, South Dakota, because most people don't regularly go to South Dakota the way that they might regularly go to Colorado on a vacation. So I ended up buying some land in Spearfish, up near the top of a mountain and it's just gorgeous. Ashley helped me do it because she is the expert realtor there. So it's awesome that you partnered with Platform because you are honestly the most knowledgeable agent in Spearfish. You know the community. I know your husband's family owns a car dealership right on the main street in Spearfish and you're just super well-connected in the community.

Tim Chermak:
So what have been some of your favorite ads, Ashley that seem to work well for you that got the most engagement and actually, I already have an answer. So I'm curious what your answer is, of what your favorite ad has been, that you have launched in the Spearfish area, whether it's a photo or a video?

Ashley Goodrich:
Yeah. So, I want to agree with Taylor. So I really loved the simplicity of the cart. Our little girl, Hayden, she was pushing the cart back. That was just something very simple. It just kind of showed like, "Hey, this is the type of person Ashley is." So the simplicity of it, people really connected with that, and I got a lot of positive feedback. I'm a lover and I care a lot about people. I mean, I know we all do, but when I get the warm and fuzzy things, that's what kind of drives me with my business. I'm very, very close with my clients and friends and stuff like that. So anyway, that was a wonderful, positive feedback. One bit photo ad that I did, which was kind of cool and kind what Heather was saying, a little bit of controversy sometimes. You do things and people have different comments, if you will.

Ashley Goodrich:
It was when I was holding a real estate sign and they photoshopped, my house could be for sale or something to that effect, that was-

Tim Chermak:
Yeah, the ads said, "Not technically for sale."

Ashley Goodrich:
Yes, "Not technically for sale," and dear, I mean, it was great. It created so much conversation. Some people were very ... they thought it was brilliant. They said, "That is brilliant. Oh my goodness." And I got phone calls, "Hey Ashley, if you have someone from my house, I mean, I have a laundry list of people that are like, if you have someone from my home ..." so that's wonderful and then, you got the people that are not so happy about it, that are maybe ... they're seeing the town grow pretty quickly. With COVID, our whole world has changed dramatically in the past few years, and that's something that we can't control.

Ashley Goodrich:
We're just trying to make light of the situation, and I try to tell people, these ads are ... they're fun. We're just trying to stay top of mind and it's-

Tim Chermak:
Yeah, so what that ad is for people that are listening that just have no idea what Ashley is talking about, is we ask people to take a picture of you standing next to one of your signs. Then, you sent that to the Platform team and our ads team Photoshop your sign, so that rather than your RE/MAX sign saying "For sale," it says, "Technically not for sale, but make us an offer anyways and for the right price, maybe we'll change our mind." That's what the sign said. So it's kind of just a joke, making fun of how crazy the sellers market has been, that you would just put a sign like this in your yard that, "Hey, my house is not technically for sale, but make us an offer anyways."

Ashley Goodrich:
Right.

Tim Chermak:
We have made it look like a legit real sign because it is your sign and we just photoshopped the for sale part. So that's why all these comments are like people going like, "Oh, is that real or are people actually putting those signs in their yards? Is that how crazy it's gotten?"

Ashley Goodrich:
Yeah. I'll take one of those. I'm like, "Yeah, we don't really have them," and actually I've had realtors from other states reach out to me, and I think that they ended up signing up for Platform because they said, "Who did that for you, and how did you do that?" And I said, "Well, if you want to know, call Tim."

Tim Chermak:
Yeah. I think-

Ashley Goodrich:
And I've passed Tim's number a few times and I think a few people have signed up because they're like, "That's amazing. I see your videos." Actually, people in other states see my videos and they go, "How on earth are you doing this?"

Tim Chermak:
I was saying in Texas, I think it was in December or January, Erica McPhail, I think is her name, I think I'm getting that right. She saw that ad that you did because someone took a screenshot of it, and I think posted it in like a realtor Facebook group that she was a part of. So, she actually called you, looked you up and was like, "Hey, how did you do that?" And then, you introduced her to us and she ended up signing for Platform and Eric is still working with us to this day just because someone thought that was a creative ad and like I said, they posted it in some realtor Facebook group. So one of my favorite ads that Ashley has done is the vanilla ice cream ad.

Tim Chermak:
Where it's one of those ads that a lot of Platform agents didn't actually do for whatever reason, but it's one of my all time favorite retargeting ads, where you take a picture of yourself holding a vanilla ice cream cone and it has to be vanilla. It can't be whatever flavor you prefer. It has to be vanilla, because we wrote this script about how special and rare the spice vanilla actually is, and historically, you hear this phrase, "Oh that's boring or that's just plain vanilla." It's like, vanilla is actually ... well, frankly vanilla is a miracle. The fact that we can have vanilla as something that humans can taste is crazy.

Tim Chermak:
I think it's one of ... it's one of the only like edible species of orchid that's ... it's like one of 35,000, that's actually edible. It blooms one day a year that you have to harvest it, and usually, it was first founded like Tahiti and Madagascar. So you would have to be insanely wealthy to ever have harvested or gotten access to a vanilla beans. So think 100 years ago, the only way you would ever taste vanilla is if you were a literal king and could afford to trade with countries like Tahiti, Madagascar and then, another level on top of that is to make ice cream, so vanilla ice cream in the summer.

Tim Chermak:
You would've had to have an army and be wealthy enough to send troops up into the mountains and come down in the summer with ice and bring ice back to your town to make ice cream with. So, we just have something as casual as a vanilla ice cream cone. We just think, "Oh no big deal. I went out and got a vanilla ice cream cone," and that's historically a miracle. So we just take-

Ashley Goodrich:
I haven't done this ad.

Tim Chermak:
It's seriously one of my favorite ads that we've ever written because it's just-

Ashley Goodrich:
That was another one of my ... there's so many of them that are great, but yes, that is another one of them. It was fantastic.

Tim Chermak:
It has nothing to do with-

Heather Mutz:
Did you get a lot of traction on it? [inaudible 00:34:27]

Tim Chermak:
So it has nothing to do with real estate. It's literally just sharing, "Hey, pay attention to the everyday miracles around you, because something as simple as a vanilla ice cream cone is actually a miracle that does exist."

Ashley Goodrich:
It's a wonderful, Leone's Creamery is a ... just a fantastic family owned business.

Tim Chermak:
I love Leone's. It's so good.

Ashley Goodrich:
Their ice cream is unbelievable. It's the one and only in town that is just-

Tim Chermak:
It's amazing.

Ashley Goodrich:
You are having an ice cream cone at the park when we were visiting them.

Tim Chermak:
Yeah, I think I probably single handedly kept them in business last summer when I was there for the month I was in Spearfish, but yeah, Leone's Creamery is awesome. So what you do is you take a picture of yourself holding a vanilla ice cream cone, and then you get it from a local place. So if you can, don't go to Dairy Queen, if there's a local ice cream place that makes their own ice cream in your area and then, we tag them in the post actually. So it usually ends with like a, "PS, here's the specific local ice cream place I recommend, I love their vanilla." Then, so often, they share it because the local ice cream place thinks it's so creative that you did all this research on just the fun facts about vanilla and they share it.

Tim Chermak:
Then, the ad takes on a life of its own, because people are just sharing it because of the fun facts. So, yeah, I mean Ashley's ad absolutely blew up because Leone's Creamery in Spearfish ended up sharing it and then, they're a very popular place. So a bunch of their fans saw it and shared it and the ad just kind of goes viral because it's cool. That gets back to what is the point of Platform? It's just keeping you top of mind in a creative way that doesn't feel like an ad. That's what all the best ads have in common.

Heather Mutz:
You all are the best at it. You all are the best at it, and everyone is like, "Oh, my gosh, you write so beautifully." I'm like, "Thank you. Thank you Tim." The script. I mean the scripts are incredible. So the scripts for like Veteran's Day and Memorial Day and those, I mean, super amazing and people ... I mean, it's yours. It looks like your own.

Tim Chermak:
All of you, obviously, when you're in a small town, building relationships, I feel like becomes even more important than an agent who might be in a big city, because it's very likely that you're going to run into those people or someone they know at some point in the future. So when you guys are out and about going to small businesses to film videos, whether it's a market update video or some sort of small business highlight, maybe it's a restaurant, maybe it's a boutique, whatever. How important has it been for your real estate career, whether we're talking about Platform ads or even before you ever signed up for Platform, how important has it been to actually build relationships with people in the community?

Tim Chermak:
So if you film a video at a small business, for example, you don't just go in and film the video and then, get the hell out of there. You go in and you actually meet the owner, talk with them, get to know them and actually build a relationship. How has that mentality impacted your business? Heather, I'll let you go first.

Heather Mutz:
So I think the thing that I always hear from people is you're just so sincere and you really do care about people and you care about our business. I try to always shop when I go into film a video or partner with them somehow to do something, and it's just ... I'm a lot like Ashley where I'm like, these people are my friends now. I mean, and I cherish those relationships so much and it always pays off business wise, but the cherry on top is having them as your forever friend, but as you're raving fan. So there's a book called Raving Fans. That's really great, but it's true, these people ... when you support them in that way, and you're spending your marketing dollars to help their business, they become your raving fans.

Heather Mutz:
So they're not just ... they don't just like you in the way you do business. They're like your cheerleader and your advertiser for you now. So it just starts snowballing because of that.

Tim Chermak:
In the future, they will probably refer you business because when you go in and you feature a local small business owner, let's say, in one of your ads, who cares if they have a house to sell or if they're buying right now|? That's not the reason you're doing it.

Heather Mutz:
Right.

Tim Chermak:
You are honestly just trying to help out their local small business and 99% of the time, they're not in the market to buy or sell a house. So again, it's not like the reason you're doing it, is you're hoping that maybe they'll list their home with you, but what does often happen is because they see how active you are in the community, and that you're a marketing expert, they often refer their friends to you. They're like, "Oh, you know what? I actually know someone who's thinking about selling, they mention to me. I should put you in touch with them."

Heather Mutz:
It happens all the time, all the time now. It's really great.

Tim Chermak:
Taylor, what about you? Have you been able to kind of network and build some relationships in the last year with Platform that maybe you didn't have before, because I've always thought, when we asked agents to film, we either call them like a market update video or a small business highlights. It's not even really a market update anymore because every month it's like, "Yup, we're still in a seller's market." You There's not a whole lot to say, but when you go and you interview these small business owners, a huge part of the reason I included that in the original Platform strategy, when I kind of drafted down nine years ago, when we started Platform, this is what the ideal monthly marketing strategy would look like for a local agent.

Tim Chermak:
I always, from day one, nine years ago, when I started the company, it was, you've got to be regularly meeting networking and featuring local small business owners in your marketing. Part of that reason is that they're the most networked people in the community. Small business owners know the most other people, so if you get to know them, you also gain access to their sphere of influence. So they can then send you business. Even if your videos you film ... this is the point I'm making, even if the actual videos or the ads you ran featuring that local small business, don't blow up and go viral or whatever.

Tim Chermak:
Just the fact that you used filming that ad or creating that post as an excuse to get to know the small business owner. If you just do that 12 times a year, so once a month, at the end of the year, you now have a deeper relationship with 12 small business owners that you didn't, at the beginning of the year. Regardless of how many clicks or video views those ads get, that's a huge win and your business is going to grow because of those 12 people who now know you. So how has that worked out for you just in the random people you've met in your community, Taylor, in the last year that maybe you didn't know super well before?

Taylor Onken:
Yeah. I've had quite a few actually, reach out to me and be like, "Oh, how can I partner with you or can you do something here?" And absolutely. I haven't been religious on the market update videos. However, we've been-

Tim Chermak:
Well clearly, clearly you're doing something right, if you sold 50 sides in your first year, so you don't have to apologize too much.

Taylor Onken:
I mean the biggest thing is as I get to go into those businesses and I actually get to see for myself what they have, and I feel like I support them a lot more, once I get to know these business owners and for me, to be able to feature them and spend my marketing dollars behind it, which benefits them and myself, it's a win-win, but at the same time, a lot of people are like, "Oh, I didn't know that they sold that there or I didn't know that they had that in Marshall," and that especially happened when I did ... around Christmas time, we featured a few of those businesses in our small town. That was a really great ad, and for instance, I ended up partnering with a place in town called Netty's and she does hand poured soy candles.

Taylor Onken:
So, we did that together, and I ordered a large order from her, then I used them for my VIPs. I did ordered extras for closing gifts and then, I have them in my office as well. So, yeah, it's just building relationships with those business owners and-

Tim Chermak:
So now, she's obviously very, very likely to refer business to you in the future, because now. She feels like she has a personal relationship with a realtor that work in a small town, I think a lot of agents listening to this, let's be honest, might be a little bit cynical or skeptical because if they're from a big city, they think, "Oh, well, yeah. I mean, if I was a realtor in a small town, it'd be like shooting fish in a barrel. It'd be so easy because there's not as many realtors, there's not as much competition. It must be easier to be an agent in a small town." And as someone who's from a small town myself, I would actually argue the opposite that it's like, no, actually that's the problem, is that in a small town, everyone doesn't already know a realtor.

Tim Chermak:
They already know effing five realtors or six or seven. When I say know ... Yeah, when I say they know a realtor, I'm not saying they know their name. I'm saying they-

Heather Mutz:
No, no, no. They go to church with them. Yeah. They have a bunch to choose from.

Tim Chermak:
Yeah. They have five or six agents that they're legitimate friends with, sometimes, literally family. I know like Heather, we talked on that first podcast episode we did with you a year ago about how you were winning a bunch of deals from people who's like their cousin or their brother or sister is a realtor and yet they were still working with you because of your marketing.

Heather Mutz:
Yeah. I'm like, I don't have to make that phone call, do I? Yeah.

Tim Chermak:
Yeah. I mean, it's.

Heather Mutz:
They're going to go with, who's going to sell their house for the most amount of money and truly market it, and when nobody else is in your town, nobody else can copy what we're doing. So, it just sets you apart.

Tim Chermak:
Yeah. I mean, in a small town, I honestly think in many ways, it's harder because so many people know agents. So the purpose then of marketing is to give people an actual reason to choose you not the other five or six agents that they're already friends with, that they already know and that dynamic just doesn't really exist in a big city. In a big city, people might know one or two agents but they don't necessarily know them super well. They just know of them, so you're not-

Heather Mutz:
I think when they're able to tell their friend or their family member, I mean, you see what Heather ... see what Taylor is doing. You see what Ashley is ... They can't even be argued with, because we are going above and beyond. We are supporting the businesses. We do have videos out daily. So I think it makes it easier for them to break the news that I'm going to go with the person that's actually being proactive.

Taylor Onken:
Yeah, absolutely. Well, ever since with being with Platform, it just seems like people just come to me and they listen more when you give advice, versus being skeptical of a real estate agent or some realtors, they just think, "Well, they don't do anything. They just get paid." Well, that's really not the case. I'm sure it is a seller's market right now too, but you still have to market the property and just throwing a sign in the yard is ... sure, it might sell your property, but it might not sell it for the top dollar, and especially with those videos that we do, it just really helps, whether it's showcasing the lifestyle or what the property actually features. When photos on the MLS doesn't do too much, sometimes.

Tim Chermak:
Yeah, and when you get on a listing appointment too, it is so valuable to be able to say, "Hey, here's a couple of the recent listings, I've promoted. Look, it got 10,000 video views on social media or it got 20,000 video views," or whatever it was. Other agents can't say that. You can actually give them, "Hey, here's the last listing I got. Here's how many video views it got. That's a definitive factual example of how you are better than other agents at marketing," because a lot of agents show up to a listing appointment with the binder, the folder they get from their brokerage about why to choose us and blah, blah.

Tim Chermak:
It's all just template, copy and paste crap. It's all generic, but when you can actually show them on Facebook or on Instagram, on YouTube, "Hey, here's the last listing I got. Look at all that social media engagement," especially if you're in a small town that has 20,000 people or less. You say, "Hey, this video got, whatever, 12,000 video views." It's like, "Well, when you factor that most towns, half the population are children ... so if you live in a town of 20,000 people, there's only about 10,000 adults there. If you have a video that got 12,000 views, that means like the average adult has actually technically seen it more than once.

Tim Chermak:
So that puts you in a power position on the listing appointment where I think this also affects the commission rates that you're able to charge. So that was actually my next question, is how has the marketing helped you defend the integrity of your commission? Because right now, especially in the sellers market, lots of agents are discounting like, "Oh I'm not charging three. I'm going to charge two and a half or charge two or I'm going to do it for a flat fee or whatever." How has the marketing and positioning helped you maintain the integrity of your commission? Because obviously if you have that brand, people almost feel like they're privileged that they get to work with you. "Oh wow. Do you have time to work with me?"

Tim Chermak:
If they feel like they're basically lucky that they get to work with Ashley or lucky that they get to work with Taylor or Heather, they're not going to try to negotiate down your commission because they feel lucky in the first place that they get to work with the top agent in the area. So talk to me about how on a listing appointment or how in those negotiations that that's affected the actual commissions that you guys have been able to charge?

Ashley Goodrich:
I have always stood by, very firmly on the integrity of my business and how I do business, and just being able to show people examples of being connected with the community and how much these videos help. I think it's not even really a question when it comes to my commission. I very rarely get those questions, but when I do, I mean, it's pretty simple. It's actually a pretty simple answer to just say, "Here we are. We're sitting here and we're talking about this, and I can assure you that I will do everything I can to market your business." And they say, "Well, you're right." I mean they automatically go, "Well, you're right," because you're doing things that other real estate agents are not doing.

Ashley Goodrich:
Like Tim and Heather and Taylor, I mean, it's so true in a small town that everyone knows about 10 to 15 realtors. I mean really truly. It is so hard in a small town, extremely difficult. So needless to say, I just think that when you stand out like Platform helps you do, I mean stand out significantly, I almost don't even need to defend the commission really much at all. The questions I do get, I just tell them, "Hey, this is what we're doing." They go, "You know, you're right. I don't even know why I asked that question." So it's almost like, it doesn't happen very often to be very honest on my side, anyway.

Taylor Onken:
It happens very frequently here. So Platform is one thing that I can use, I guess as what you would call leverage. I basically can put it out on a platter for them and say, "Here's your menu. You can take the 5% or you can take the 7%, and here's the difference between the 5% and the 7%." I have the marketing, I list all the things that I do, especially with Platform, things like that. I say, I'm not the agent who just puts a sign in your yard and then of course, we bring up-

Tim Chermak:
By the way, I'm going to add this disclaimer, so all of us don't get sued, that commissions are always negotiable and there is no set pricing for commissions because we're all licensed real estate agents, and we understand that it's always commission based and it's not a cartel. So, everything is negotiable. All right. Thank you for that legal disclaimer and the other thing I'm going to add quick, because people are probably just like trying to pick their jaws up off the floor, when Taylor said that she charges 7%. A lot of her listings in her area are literally like 120,000, $150,000 homes. So she has plenty of the 200, 300, and on a lakefront properties, you're obviously getting way up there, you can have million dollar listings.

Tim Chermak:
A lot of the homes in these really small towns literally might still be $140,000. So, the reason that you might charge a little bit more commission is you have to, to make it worth your time to work that listing, because we all know like working $140,000 house can sometimes be even more time than a $400,000 house because the type of people involved in that transaction typically have way more questions. So that's why you might charge 7% on a deal like that. Am I right?

Taylor Onken:
Yup, absolutely. Exactly. Yup, and so like I said, I don't know if we caught this before, but I'm so ... we're very rural. It's mostly lower dollar properties, compared to big metro areas or whatever.

Tim Chermak:
Taylor, when you're on those listing appointments, what does that conversation typically go like when you present, "Hey, here's the options. I can list your house for five or 7%." Then, I'm also curious how many listing appointments do you lose? How often has it happened, where someone called you to list their house and then they didn't work with you and they worked with another agent. What does that typical percentage look like?

Taylor Onken:
Actually, just, I think last week or two weeks ago, I lost a listing because a different brokerage came in and said that they would list it for 10,000 higher and 1%, less of commission, and there's a reason that things happen, and that's all I tell myself because I know that what I do and the work that I do, and the marketing dollars I put behind it is worth what I charge for my business, and that's just kind of what it comes down to. So, a lot of people, like I said, do ask. And I'm all about a great discount and things like that, but at the same time, you get what you pay for. So, like I said, I feel like I know the worth of my business and what I do. So that's kind of where ... and Platform is a big part of it.

Tim Chermak:
Yeah, and also, when you're on a listing appointment, it should be like ordering off of a menu when you go out to eat. It's like, you're not bargaining with the waiter, like, "Can you do the salmon half off? Is there any way that you could maybe knock 10, 20% off this, because I'm really interested, but the price is a little bit steep for me." When you have that marketing, it puts you in a more powerful negotiating position and I'm not sure what your percentage is Taylor, but it's like, if you did 50 sides in your first year, clearly you're probably winning a lot of those listings, if you did 50 sides. How many listings did you have your first year, so last year?

Taylor Onken:
Listings, I closed 37 listings, but I think I had a total ... I have lots and just land listed, so I think there was 62 listed and I closed 37 of them.

Ashley Goodrich:
Good job. Good job. Yes, that's fantastic.

Heather Mutz:
Yeah, that's amazing, but I will say your business changes from buyers to sellers as you are with Platform, and we all know that we'd much rather be listing homes than running around buyers everywhere. So it's huge, it is huge the way your business will shift and you just have people calling you, you're not out hunting for business.

Taylor Onken:
Yup, exactly. Yup.

Tim Chermak:
Heather, how has it helped you in terms of the listing side, because I know that you have been able to pick up a lot of listings in the last several years. What do those conversations typically go like when you quote what you charge for commission and you go over the net numbers? Do you get pushback? Are people asking you to discount? What typically happens for you?

Heather Mutz:
I'm really not. The only time I'm getting asked to discount is if I'm on the buy and sell side, but when I go to these listing appointments, I would say 99% of the ... I'm not getting any pushback on the percentage that I do 6% and I spend a lot of marketing dollars to market your property, and they're like, "Oh, I know. I'm seeing it. I see what you do. That's why I called you. It's basically what I'm getting." Then, when they see the video about, a lot of times, the pictures and the marketing is so good that then, the video comes out and it's under contract in 48 hours.

Heather Mutz:
I still run them because other people need to see that this is how I'm marketing your property, and that just running these listing tours and creative listing videos has gotten me a ton more. So I've lately been throwing even more money toward each listing video because I'm seeing the benefit of that.

Tim Chermak:
How much do you guys all spend in a typical month on your ads? Do you know what your monthly ads budget is approximately on the actual ad spend?

Heather Mutz:
Now, I'm spending close to 1500, probably a month.

Taylor Onken:
I'm about 1200, I think. I gave her the okay for 1500.

Ashley Goodrich:
Yeah, I would say something around that mark 1500, $2,000.

Tim Chermak:
I think that that is something really important that we shouldn't just skim over because having a large, healthy ads budget like that disproportionately makes a difference if you're in a smaller area because of simple math.

Ashley Goodrich:
I don't mean to interrupt, but I do have to say this. At first, of course, because that's a lot of money. It's a lot of money to do advertising and you think about it, and for a moment I thought to myself, there's no way I can do this. This is just too much money. I just feel like it's not going to be ... it's not going to work, but the moment that you put it into perspective, in the aspect of, if I sell one home over, it will pay for itself 10 times over. Then, if you sell five homes or 10 homes in a month, it's certainly paying for itself at that point. I mean, so when you put it into perspective of really the money that you're spending and the productivity of those ads, it completely makes sense, and it's a no brainer at that point.

Ashley Goodrich:
I mean, even if it takes a month or two or three to get there. The moment that it starts to build up, you're going, this is just ... like I said, it's a no brainer to put money towards those ads and spend money on ads, for sure. I couldn't agree with Tim more on that.

Tim Chermak:
Yeah, because all of you guys are at the point in your business now where you can look back and you're like, "Oh wow, I can't believe I was ever scared of spending money, because it is such a good value in hindsight," even though it was really scary at first, because there's certainly agents listening to this right now, that are in that point where it's really scary. They are spending money on the marketing, but they have not yet got a return and they're kind of freaking out like, "Oh yeah, because I've been putting a lot of money towards this Platform strategy. I hope it starts working soon." And all three of you are in completely different areas of the country, different states, and you've all seen it work if you stick with it.

Tim Chermak:
The point I was making earlier about math is that if you get to the point where you can spend more than $1000 dollars a month on the ads, it just is like pouring fuel on a bonfire, if you're in a small town, because if you're in an area that let's say has 20,000 people, 25,000 people, whatever, every $500 you spend in ads roughly means 50,000 people see your ads. So, if you can spend $1000 dollars a month on ads with basic CPMs on how it works with Facebook and Instagram, you're probably reaching 100,000 people. So if there's only 20,000 people in your entire area, that means ... and half of that 20,000 is children ...

Tim Chermak:
So there's actually, let's say 10,000 adults in your area, but your ads are reaching 100,000 people a month, it means the average person in your community is seeing you 10 times every month, pop up in their Facebook newsfeed or Instagram newsfeed or they're seeing your videos on YouTube, as part of the Platform strategy. So in a small town, the concentration that you can create with that same ads, budget is so much more concentrated than you can if you're in like Houston or Atlanta or Chicago or something where it's like, well, there's millions of people.

Tim Chermak:
So you're still reaching a lot of people with your ads, but it's not as if 100% of the adult population is seeing your ads. We work with Jess Lacour up in Wyoming, in the Gillette area. Jess spends, I think over $10,000 a month just on billboards, in the Gillette area. Gillette is a small town that only has, I think 30,000 ... maybe Gillette is 40,000 people. I can't remember, but it's still a very much ... Gillette, Wyoming is a small town, frankly, as all towns in Wyoming are. Jess spends I think 12 to $15,000 a month on marketing total in a small town, like her Platform budget is a couple thousand dollars a month just for the Facebook and social media ads. She gets a return, exactly what Ashley was saying.

Tim Chermak:
It's not like you're spending money on advertising, you're investing it, because yes, Jess might spend upwards of almost $150,000 a year on advertising, which is more money than a lot of agents even make in GCI, but she did over a million dollars in GCI last year. I think it was maybe even closer to 1.5 million in GCI last year in a small town in Wyoming. So, it's all about, what's the ROI? It's not what you spend, it's what did you get out of it? When you're in a small town, I think there's a multiplier effect because if 80% or if 100% of the adults in your community are seeing your ads, just because there's less people there, so that $1,000 budget saturates all them, you're going to get more results than a person who spends $1,000 budget, that same budget, but it's in a big city like Atlanta.

Tim Chermak:
It's like, well, that's a drop in the bucket with the millions and millions of people that are in a big city. So there is this opportunity to get even better results, if you just think through the very basic fourth grade math of how many people are seeing your ads. So, looking back, we've talked about what some of your favorite ads are. We talked through what some of the budget is. Why do you think more agents don't just copy you? That's always been something fascinating to me is that ... especially in a small town, if you blow up out of nowhere and all of a sudden you're this super successful agent that maybe a couple years ago, no one had ever even heard of, why do you think other agents in your area aren't just copying you?

Tim Chermak:
Copying the strategy because you would think that they could see what you're doing and then, they would start doing the same thing, but that typically doesn't happen or maybe they try for a month and then they give up.

Ashley Goodrich:
I think because they don't have Platform. I mean, I don't know. It's as simple as that. I know that there's been a few agents in my town that have reached out, I believe to you and said, "Hey, I'm just inquiring about how they can hook up with you," and perhaps they've tried it, but there's just something about Platform and the algorithm. I mean, you guys are just very good at what you do. I mean, I don't think anyone can copy, and quite frankly-

Heather Mutz:
I mean, they try. I've had a few try, but they give up so quickly because they have like 200 views on their videos and not 5,000. I think it's so discouraging for them because they don't know how we're doing it.

Ashley Goodrich:
Yeah, you're the ... sorry, go ahead, Taylor.

Taylor Onken:
I was just going to say, I kind of see some of the other local agents around here, trying to kind of do a market update or things like that, that obviously they have seen from Platform, however, they don't know the behind the scenes work and how Platform has made sure that what we do put out, works. So yeah, I've seen it happen.

Heather Mutz:
We have a secret weapon.

Ashley Goodrich:
I don't know even know, that's what ... Yes, I agree with Heather. I mean, I certainly don't know what goes on behind the scenes and as Taylor was mentioning earlier, all of the scripts ... I mean there's a lot of time and effort and passion and a lot of things behind Platform Marketing, and you have a wonderful team that I have no idea what you do. Sometimes people go, "How do they do? I mean, how do you do that?" And I go, "I have a wonderful team that I work with and they're great friends of mine and they kick ass at what they do." That's basically what I say. And they're like, "They sure do." Really, that's all I have to say. I mean, it's something, it's like a little secret.

Ashley Goodrich:
Yeah, but you should be very proud of yourself because you do something clearly that works for lots of people.

Heather Mutz:
That's life changing for agents like us in small towns that are able to dominate a market where ... like in mine, I'm not from here. It's the good old boy brokers from here, and guess who's gotten best agent two years in a row. I'm kind of like causing a few waves because I'm not from here and I have shaken things up, but it's pretty neat too, and I think inspiring to other people, not from here. I don't know, it all works, and it's all about building the brand.

Ashley Goodrich:
Sorry, go ahead, Tim.

Tim Chermak:
No, Ashley, go ahead. Go ahead.

Ashley Goodrich:
I was just going to say, I actually in a similar boat as Heather, because I moved to Spearfish, South Dakota in 2010, 12 years ago. So I've been here for a while, but I came here as an outsider, and when you come in as an outsider to a small town, it's very cliquey, if you will, what have you.

Tim Chermak:
Especially, when you move from California to a small town.

Ashley Goodrich:
Yeah. I came from Southern California to Spearfish, South Dakota. So everyone was like, "What on earth are you doing here?" So, that's a really long short story, but anyway, where I'm going with this is yes, it was very, very difficult coming into a market where no one knew me from Adam. Then, I had to just work really, really hard and finally, I said, I need to try something different, and the moment that I did it was well-received. It probably took a little while, and I don't know, people probably have, have opinions about it. Not everyone is going to like you and I am totally fine with that. I think the moment that you ... if you're going to go in guns blazing and you're just going to do your best, that's what it takes.

Ashley Goodrich:
You know what I'm saying? You have to have thick skin in this business, first of all, and not everyone is going to like you. Not everyone is going to think what you're doing is right, but when you're collaborating with your community and you're meeting people and you're helping people, I think it turns itself around very quickly and then, the positive ... it just very gently kind of soaks in if you will, and then, it just becomes where you see people and they go, "Oh my gosh, Hey Ashley." I mean, people are excited to see you and people give you hugs. That's just the kind of the person that I am, but it turned things around for me in a very beautiful way, I have to say.

Ashley Goodrich:
And a lot of agents that have been here for a very, very long time, I am still great friends with every single realtor in this town. I choose to do that and have good relationships with the realtors in town, but they tell me all the time, they're like, "You kick ass, man. You do good." And I'm like, "Thank you. I appreciate that." We're all in this together. I'm also that type of person that even though I have competition, I don't think of it that way in a way. I think we're all here to help each other. Sell each other-

Tim Chermak:
Yeah, even in a small town ... that's the point I want to emphasize too, even in a small town, there are still so many transactions going on, that you can still have an abundance mentality. It's like, you don't need to get every transaction with a buyer or seller. Even in a tiny town, there are so many deals going on that if you just get a small percentage of it, you're going to become wealthy as a real estate agent.

Ashley Goodrich:
Right, and I'm very big about keeping good relationships with every person, no matter who they are, whether they're realtors, bank. I mean, especially realtors, because again, we're all in this together and I don't want it to ever seem like that. Anyway, so that's also been a positive thing for me.

Taylor Onken:
I also have to say, I feel with the ... us ourselves, but along with Platform, it makes us seem more like a lighthouse rather than a tugboat because we have a lot of positivity and different joking matters where the content that we post, it's enlightening, I guess, more so rather-

Tim Chermak:
Yeah, it's attracting people to you versus it making it look like you're trying to manually work to get clients that analogy we've used of being a lighthouse versus a tugboat.

Taylor Onken:
Yeah.

Tim Chermak:
A lighthouse just shines its light. It does its job, and if people want to heed your advice and work with you, they can, but the lighthouse does its job day in and day out, regardless. A tugboat has to go out and manually save people one by one, and that's actually a lot harder than being a lighthouse. So yeah, absolutely. All right, one question. This is kind of a change of topic, but for each of you three, you've grown your business so much in the last couple years, what is a personal thing that you've been able to buy or invest in, in your personal life that you otherwise wouldn't have been able to afford before your business grew to the point it's at now?

Tim Chermak:
Whether it's, I don't know, vacation, a car, a house, whatever. What is something that you're able to do now or purchase in your personal life that you couldn't afford before your business grew?

Ashley Goodrich:
I'll just jump in here really quick. We're building a beautiful house. We're building a house, a home of our dreams. We bought a piece of land that I probably wouldn't have been able to ... we probably wouldn't have been able to do before. We're in the process of building our forever home and probably something that would've been pretty difficult. We spend a lot of time with my family in California, which is pretty mandatory for me because I am very tight with my family in California. So I mean, other than that, we're very humble and very simple people. We don't have a lot of things and what have you, but we spend a lot of time on memories and that's what's important to my family and myself. So that's what's been really important for me.

Tim Chermak:
Awesome.

Taylor Onken:
That's awesome. I guess I'll say for myself, working a 40 hour a week job, being a single mom of two, paying a mortgage, things like that, I was able ... I purchased a new vehicle and not only being able to purchase things, again, kind of relating back to what Ashley had said, we rely a lot on like memories and fun things like that. My kids are young, so last night I just got back from Phoenix. I brought my kids there for like four or five days just because I wanted to spend extra time with them. It's hard to do that just at home, doing the same old thing. So I was able to just take a trip, bring them there and enjoy it for a few days.

Heather Mutz:
Good for you. That's awesome.

Tim Chermak:
A quick trip to Phoenix isn't something you have to save up for years to do anymore. You can just kind of be like, "Hey, let's go to Phoenix for five days," and you can afford it.

Heather Mutz:
Yup.

Tim Chermak:
That's awesome.

Heather Mutz:
This might make me cry because I really ... I feel like Platform has allowed me the freedom to raise my three daughters alone and stay in my home. We're actually ... Friday, they're drawing out our lines for our new pool that we're putting in the backyard and just things that ... dreams that I had that I never thought that I could do by myself. I took them on four vacations this last year. Nothing slowed down with me being alone. In fact, I've actually gotten to do more with them and have more of our dreams kind of become reality. So it's mind blowing to me, and I know that the marketing and the growing of my brand and business is what's gotten us here and love.

Heather Mutz:
I love creating memories with the girls and don't have ... my oldest is a freshman in high school. So the fact that it's happened so fast for me has been great because I only have three years left with Addison. So the pool is going in. It's like a non-negotiable. I have three years left to make these memories with them. So it's been super exciting.

Ashley Goodrich:
That is wonderful. That's awesome to hear.

Heather Mutz:
Thank you.

Ashley Goodrich:
Yeah.

Tim Chermak:
Yeah. So let me end ... Yeah, that's inspirational because I mean, it's always fun when I hear an agent, tell me ... who started the Platform strategy? "Oh, my GC. I grew from this to this or my volume grew from this to this," but when you actually hear specifically what that meant in their personal life, that's way more interesting to me than hearing what the numbers was. What were you able to do with that extra money with you and your family that maybe you didn't have before, that's awesome. So what do you think ... the final question I'll ask each three of you, because I know that we've gone over time here, because this has been a cool conversation. So I will let you guys go.

Tim Chermak:
I got one more question though. What do you think ... And this is just your opinion. There's not a right or wrong answer, but what do you think is the biggest difference between what it takes to be successful, building a brand in a small town as a realtor versus what it takes to be successful as a real estate agent, if you're in a bigger city?

Ashley Goodrich:
I think persistence, I think never giving up. I think being different, standing out, helping your community going above and beyond. Not just ... I don't do this business just ... I mean, of course we do this to make money, but I do it to help people and I think ... gosh, that's kind of a hard question. I mean, I don't know, I just think that-

Tim Chermak:
What skills do you think you have to have or what have you done differently, Ashley, as someone who's from a big city in Southern California, what does it take to be successful as a real estate agent in a small town compared to if you were a real estate agent in a big city?

Ashley Goodrich:
I think it's the genuine, your person. You are showing people just the genuine person that you are. People are going to really get to know you. I think Platform has allowed people that don't know me to get to know me and being able to go into those small businesses. A Lot of people always wonder, "Oh gosh, I wonder what she's like or I wonder what that person is like. We're not friends. I wonder." When you take the time and you take a moment to stop and not ... because I'm from Southern California, I used to go a thousand miles an hour and I took life down about 100 notches when I moved here. By doing so, it has allowed me to genuine ... I mean, I've always been a genuine person, but stop and smell the roses.

Ashley Goodrich:
Take time with people, and when you do that and you invest in someone and you invest in people, they see who you are and they want to work with you. They trust you and trust is huge in a small town and they know that when they're with you, that they will be taken care of, and you've taken the time, the extra time to-

Tim Chermak:
Yup, so I think one thing that I will interject here of what you said about trust, that's probably how I would answer the question of what's so important in a small town versus if you're a big city agent. To be clear, I'm not saying that trust doesn't matter if you're in a big city because it does. If you blow a deal with someone and you screw up or you give them bad advice or maybe you gave them great advice, but they're just stupid, and they're convinced that it's your fault, that something didn't go the way they want or they didn't get the price they want or they didn't get the house or whatever, right?

Tim Chermak:
If you lose trust with someone, frankly, whether it's your fault or not, in a big city, if there's hundreds of thousands or millions of people, there are still plenty of buyers and sellers out there that can work with you where having one person hate you doesn't mean it's the end of your business, because there's so many more. It's like peeing in the ocean. It doesn't even matter. There's so many transactions.

Ashley Goodrich:
It keeps you warm. Peeing in the ocean keeps you warm.

Tim Chermak:
Yeah and now, everyone knows that when Tim goes into the ocean, he's probably peeing. So when you're in a small town though, you very literally cannot afford to have anyone hate you, because if you're in an area where there's only 10,000, 15,000, 20,000 people and a deal goes sideways and it ends up where ... again, whether it's your fault or not, this is what I'm trying to emphasize, whether it's your fault or not, if you don't make it right, that could harm the rest of your career, because they will tell their friends and family and then, those friends and family don't know any of the details about the situation.

Tim Chermak:
If they told them that, "Oh, Heather is awful or don't work with Taylor, don't work with Ashley. She really screwed me over on such and such deal," it could be totally incorrect, but bad news travels really fast and your reputation is everything in a small town, where in a bigger city, it's easier to recover from that because not everyone knows everyone. So I think that's how I would answer the question is that trust is always important, of course. If you're in Dallas or Atlanta or Chicago or Seattle or some big city, trust is important. It always is, as long as you're working with humans, trust is important. There's much more room to recover. If something bad happens or if you get a negative review or something in a big city, in a small town, you have to make it right.

Tim Chermak:
You have to have the whole community trust you or it could frankly ruin your entire business, even if the other 99% of people think you're amazing. So Taylor, Heather, how would you answer that question? What do you think is the difference between being a successful agent in a big city versus a small town? What does it take specifically to be a successful agent if you're in a rural area or small town?

Heather Mutz:
I was going to say, it's not a numbers game, it's a relationship game. It's just not. It's not a numbers game. Everybody knows you, everybody has to trust you, and I think what you're saying about always doing the right thing, that's my philosophy. I always make it right. I always do the right thing. It's not about money. It's about a great experience for people, and people know that, people feel that. When it's not about money to you and it's about you helping them and you creating a really smooth, easy experience for them, things go wrong all the time. How do you handle that and make it right?

Heather Mutz:
That is so important because like you said, how you handle one ... I mean, everybody talks, everybody knows who you are in this area. There's no escaping whatever happened. So it better be a positive ... even if it was a hard transaction, it better be how you handled it with such a positive experience for them, that they're still your raving fan. So it's just crucial. Your relationships and how you handle things is so crucial. Whereas in a big city, I think it's a number saying, you move on, you don't know everybody.

Tim Chermak:
Yeah. I mean, in a small town, whether or not it's a referral deal, you have to assume every transaction is a referral deal, even if it's a lead you got from somewhere, every transaction is a referral deal because I promise you, they know multiple people who are already in your sphere of influence. So, if they leave not happy ... again, whether or not it's your fault, if they leave not happy, that can poison the entire well, because the well is a lot smaller in a small town. Cool. Well, give me one sentence and then we'll wrap this up here. Give me one sentence of your best advice for any realtors listening to this, let's say, who are already in the Platfam and they're in that process where they're creating content, but they haven't yet got results yet.

Tim Chermak:
They're just waiting for things to really start popping, what is your one sentence, piece of advice for someone who just started, but they haven't yet seen results? What would you say to encourage them with just one sentence?

Ashley Goodrich:
Do the videos, because I was terrified to do the videos, I do not like being on camera, I didn't like it. It was very out of my wheelhouse. I just don't ... didn't feel comfortable, but it every time I do the videos and I do my homework and I do what I'm supposed to do, it works. So do the videos, that would be my advice.

Heather Mutz:
Be consistent and give yourself a year and you will see the snowball effect happen.

Taylor Onken:
This is a quote I saw yesterday, "Early to bed, early to rise, work like hell and advertise," and listen to your account manager. Yeah.

Ashley Goodrich:
Yeah.

Heather Mutz:
Yeah.

Ashley Goodrich:
I love it. That's a good one.

Heather Mutz:
I have two closings, I have to head to, guys.

Tim Chermak:
Of course you do. Of course you do. All right. Cool. Thanks guys, and thanks for everyone listening, and we will see you on the next episode of the Platform Marketing Show.